[nlakind]

Originally Posted by methodtim

It's safer to do drive at night on a twisty road fast than it is in the middle of the day? Really? I am seriously at a loss for words at the bill of goods you're trying to sell me.

to me, canyon running is safer at night: you can see on-coming head lights from quite a distance, there is far less traffic on the road, if any, & there typically aren't any bicyclists..obviously, if it was a question of canyon running during the day or night if the canyon was closed to the public, for example, of course, i would agree with you! but in terms of putting others at risk, it's safer to canyon run at night..

Originally Posted by methodtim

Your logic is falling completely flat on its face here. First, I have already stipulated that when stuff happens to someone that's out of their control, it's tragic and (by implication) I am sympathetic. What you're describing here are random acts that might happen to anyone at any time.

i'm sorry i didn't make my point clear, i wasn't talking about random acts to a normal everyday driver. my point was in regard to this kid! & if he was driving the way he was in that video during the day it would've been far more dangerous to others.

Originally Posted by methodtim

I agree that at night you can see oncoming headlights. But you're still conveniently leaving out the excessive speed component. As the video clearly showed, the GT-R didn't crash into an oncoming car, but into a wall that was not illuminated. The things that led to his crash were:

1) Excessive speed (it's obvious he couldn't control the car at that speed)
2) Driver error (see number 1)
3) Darkness (I challenge you to tell me that he would have taken the corner that fast if that wall was lit up and he saw it)

Look, I'm all for a good debate (some might say I go out of my way to hunt one down), but any way you slice it, your dog just won't hunt. The kid was driving recklessly, he crashed, there's video proof of this. There's no way that driving at that speed in the dark is safer than driving at speed in the daytime. Again, I challenge you to disprove this. Please be sure to show your work.

1. i wasn't arguing excessive speed, that would be the point of a canyon run
2. obviously
3. thanks to the invention of head lights, he knew there was a wall there..i'm sorry, but i've driven the canyons at night many many many times & seeing the next curve isn't hard at whatever speed due to the fact that there's always some kind of huge yellow warning sign of a sharp turn ahead not to mention he has HID head lights that make a canyon pretty visible..

Originally Posted by methodtim

I did a lot of stupid things when I was younger. A LOT. Yes, I'm being harsh on the kid. But here's my logic. First and foremost, if anyone were to wish ill of me for all the stupid things that I've done, I wouldn't begrudge them one bit. The way I see it, I'm really lucky to have gotten through my 20's unscathed. (Un)fortunately (depending on how you look at it), I've always been a tough love kind of guy. If you do dumb shit, you deserve anything that comes your way. It's apparent that we have different philosophies regarding this so I don't expect you to agree with me one bit.

So does the kid in the video deserve to die? I don't know and, frankly, I don't care. All I know is that he was doing something really, really dumb and if it wasn't for the fortunate placement of that wall, he'd be in a world of hurt. My initial reaction was that I wished the wall wasn't there. Thinking back, I still think the wall shouldn't have been there. Like I said, Darwin.

& in regards to "deserving to die" - we definitely have different philosophies on this because i don't believe that anybody deserves to die, well, nobody deserves to die for being stupid & being a kid!
obviously, serial killers, rapists & child molesters can all get shot in the face, i could give a shit less but saying that somebody deserves what he has coming for being immature is ignorance.