[gonzo]

My hands a long too. Go to a good shop and look at the HK's. The switchable grip center's are very nice. S M L , I believe. The L felt good but the gun felt a little squirmy. The M was the right fit. You get all 3 with purchase. You are looking around 850-900 buckaroos with some target and defense ammo.

[Vegas_Sirk]

Originally Posted by gonzo

My hands a long too. Go to a good shop and look at the HK's. The switchable grip center's are very nice. S M L , I believe. The L felt good but the gun felt a little squirmy. The M was the right fit. You get all 3 with purchase. You are looking around 850-900 buckaroos with some target and defense ammo.

Thats not bad. The Sig P229R Conceal I was looking at was in the mid $9s
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[raquelmister]

Originally Posted by ChadE

Wow thats helpful...just for future reference dont post if it dont help the OP

I know i am breaking my own rule right now as I know nothing about guns but that just bothered me.

relax.

[010101]

Originally Posted by ChadE

Wow thats helpful...just for future reference dont post if it dont help the OP

I know i am breaking my own rule right now as I know nothing about guns but that just bothered me.

1+

That was definitely the dumbest post of the week. Why not respond to all threads you're not interested in or don't like? This idiot should go into the classifieds and post a respond to every "want to buy" thread saying "sorry, but I don't have one of those for sale"

[toofasttooslow]

Start off with a small monetary investment. You might find out that you really don't enjoy owning one so don't drop a lot of coin ($300-$400)the first purchase. Start with a revolver too -something like a .38 Smith and Wesson. Revolvers are perfect for a novice - especially when it comes to self defense. When you get tired of it move on to something larger like a 9mm or .40 auto. Take some local gun safety courses at your local police department. They usually offer them for free or a modest fee. They will give you some insight on what it's really like to be a gun carrying citizen as well as marksmanship pointers.

[Vegas_Sirk]

Originally Posted by gum5h03

Start off with a small monetary investment. You might find out that you really don't enjoy owning one so don't drop a lot of coin ($300-$400)the first purchase. Start with a revolver too -something like a .38 Smith and Wesson. Revolvers are perfect for a novice - especially when it comes to self defense. When you get tired of it move on to something larger like a 9mm or .40 auto. Take some local gun safety courses at your local police department. They usually offer them for free or a modest fee. They will give you some insight on what it's really like to be a gun carrying citizen as well as marksmanship pointers.

Good pointers. I have shot revolvers and have found them kind of boring. I own several shot guns as I come from a big hunting family and started shooting trap at 7 and have learned with shot guns just as with car parts you get what you pay for.
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[HyperM3]

Originally Posted by M3This

Thats not bad. The Sig P229R Conceal I was looking at was in the mid $9s

Ok, since you brought up Sigs, I felt the need to post again.

My first gun was a Glock 17. Its what my buddies had and what I learned on. Thats what we started doing competitions with. However, I really didnt like the boxiness of the grip(I was the only one). Then I picked up a Sig 228. OMG I fell in love. It just felt perfect right off the bat and I never picked up my Glock again. Then I got a 1911(because everyone deserves to have one in their collection).

However, I didnt suggest these higher brands(Sig, HK, etc.) because I figured for your first gun, you shouldnt be putting out a lot of $$. Like another poster said, you might find that you dont enjoy shooting the gun. And if it only becomes a conceal and carry, theres no reason to spend twice as much when youll probably never use it.

I suggested the XD because the angle of the grip compared to the Glocks are more inline with natural wrist architecture. I found them to be more comfortable. Like I said, if I were to do a gun specifically for CC, it would be the XD45. That or the new Kimber 45 thats like a small 1911.

[Vegas_Sirk]

Originally Posted by HyperM3

Ok, since you brought up Sigs, I felt the need to post again.

My first gun was a Glock 17. Its what my buddies had and what I learned on. Thats what we started doing competitions with. However, I really didnt like the boxiness of the grip(I was the only one). Then I picked up a Sig 228. OMG I fell in love. It just felt perfect right off the bat and I never picked up my Glock again. Then I got a 1911(because everyone deserves to have one in their collection).

However, I didnt suggest these higher brands(Sig, HK, etc.) because I figured for your first gun, you shouldnt be putting out a lot of $$. Like another poster said, you might find that you dont enjoy shooting the gun. And if it only becomes a conceal and carry, theres no reason to spend twice as much when youll probably never use it.

I suggested the XD because the angle of the grip compared to the Glocks are more inline with natural wrist architecture. I found them to be more comfortable. Like I said, if I were to do a gun specifically for CC, it would be the XD45. That or the new Kimber 45 thats like a small 1911.

The XD's pricing is very attractive. I see the mags have given it a lot of awards and I also like the safety features of them (however in a self defense situation they might be too much). I think I'll drive my ass down to the range after work today and see what feels good in my hands.

BTW why would you go with the 45 for the CC? Just because its got the most stopping power? Also what do you guys think about .40? as I heard they are as easy to shoot as a 9mm yet have a little more power to them.
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[HyperM3]

Originally Posted by M3This

The XD's pricing is very attractive. I see the mags have given it a lot of awards and I also like the safety features of them (however in a self defense situation they might be too much). I think I'll drive my ass down to the range after work today and see what feels good in my hands.

BTW why would you go with the 45 for the CC? Just because its got the most stopping power? Also what do you guys think about .40? as I heard they are as easy to shoot as a 9mm yet have a little more power to them.

Excellent questions. First off, if its specifically for CC, you want 45. Reason being is stopping power. 9 is the most popular size and cheapest ammo(aside from 22 of course). But a 9 wont necessarily stop/kill you, a 45 most likely will. You want to make 1 shot count, not count all your shots! I use 9 for all my IPDA/IPSC competitions. However, I do use my 45 1911 for steel knockdown matches.

Regardless, again, you dont have to buy a lot of ammo if youre using it just for CC. You can get a case and call it a day.

40 is a good round(most law enforcement have been going to that). It has the stopping power of a 45 in a shell the size of a 9. However, youre going to be paying more for that round plus its not as easy to find, say, in a situaion where you needed to reload from someone elses batch of ammo.

Thats why you might find it hard pressed to find a do-everything gun. If you get a small gun for CC, its most likely going to be a short barrel. You wont find too much accuracy with this gun for long distance at the range or any pistol matches. I know some midsize Sigs are made for CC with all edges beveled down(really cool if you ask me). However you might not want a midsize.

Seriously though, if its for protection in the home, just get a shotgun. I would never use a pistol in my home and a shotgun is way more intimidating. If youre getting it to carry on your person or in your car, pray you never have to use it. If you want something you can have fun with at the range and use for safety, I suggest a midsize 3.75-4 inch barrelled gun.

[Vegas_Sirk]

Originally Posted by HyperM3

Seriously though, if its for protection in the home, just get a shotgun. I would never use a pistol in my home and a shotgun is way more intimidating. If youre getting it to carry on your person or in your car, pray you never have to use it. If you want something you can have fun with at the range and use for safety, I suggest a midsize 3.75-4 inch barrelled gun.

Thanks for all the excellent info. For home protection I am already planning on a pistol grip 12 gauge. Its easy to keep loaded by my bed or under it and if it ever comes down to me needing to use it I can point it in the general direction while half asleep and be able to hit what Im aiming at. It also will not travel thought walls and hit my neighbors.

Im not a fan of how the sub-compacts feel him my hands. They seem too small. I for sure would get a regular compact with a 4" barrel. Its main going to be for carry on my person and in my car.

So the reason a lot of Law Enforcement use 9mm and .40 are because when they are shooting its only to protect their selves and not necessarily kill the individual (more like disable them). Correct?

No matter what I get I will send some serious range time with it to be accurate and sufficient with it, so I would like something that I can get to a point of being accurate on a re-occurring basis
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[UncleWede]

Re: 12 guage by the bed. Don't leave it loaded, or if you must you better have a lock on the trigger, and/or potentially the chamber. We don't want to read about you on the news, either missing a foot/hand, or charged with negligence.

[toofasttooslow]

Originally Posted by M3This

So the reason a lot of Law Enforcement use 9mm and .40 are because when they are shooting its only to protect their selves and not necessarily kill the individual (more like disable them). Correct?

Actually that is somewhat of a misnomer. When a police officer needs to fire his weapon it is almost always to kill. Center mass, stopping power, etc. 9mm does a damn good job of taking an average perp down without over penetrating through them and killing bystanders. .40 also does an excellent job and will generally penetrate light armor (car doors, house doors, etc) while the 9mm will be thwarted by some of those depending on the conditions. .45 ACP will generally penetrate just about anything below true armor. Once body armor or steel/ceramic plates are used forget about any sort of pistol round to center mass.

As far as compact autos, go try on the H&K USP compact. It's fairly concealable, is totally reliable. It shoots like butter so your hand won't feel like you've pounded nails all day when you shoot a couple hundred rounds through it. I have a .40 USP compact and I love it. It can be a little bit pricey though.

Another one is the Glock 19. Another bulletproof gun - literally. I had a Glock 19 for years and only gave it up to upgrade to the .40. That thing went through all sorts of things including saltwater, sand and some serious mud. It never let me down. It's a bit cheaper than the higher end brands too at just a hair over $500. You can chamber 9mm +P rounds in the Glock and make the ballistics near to a .40 or .357.

Also, stay away from Sig's. They are sweeeet guns, but extremely heavy and bulky. They are perfect for duty guns because they are great as supplementary weapons when empty (think pistol whip). They are some of the most accurate weapons out of the box but definitely feel their weight with limited use of polycarbonfibre.

[HyperM3]

Originally Posted by M3This

For home protection I am already planning on a pistol grip 12 gauge.

Thats exactly what I did. Benelli Supernova Tactical FTW!

[HyperM3]

Originally Posted by gum5h03

Also, stay away from Sig's. They are sweeeet guns, but extremely heavy and bulky. They are perfect for duty guns because they are great as supplementary weapons when empty (think pistol whip). They are some of the most accurate weapons out of the box but definitely feel their weight with limited use of polycarbonfibre.

I wouldnt tell someone to stay away from a certain gun. I personally love my 228(lighter weight because of the different slide). And that gun never gets tiring no matter how long I hold it. Just because you feel the weight sooner doesnt mean the next person will. Also, most guns weigh about the same so saying one weighs more so stay away is like saying stay away from all guns. Considering you think the Sigs are heavy, I can only assume youll never own a 1911.

[yellowg555]

How much does a good home defense shotty cost?

[Vegas_Sirk]

Originally Posted by gum5h03

Actually that is somewhat of a misnomer. When a police officer needs to fire his weapon it is almost always to kill. Center mass, stopping power, etc. 9mm does a damn good job of taking an average perp down without over penetrating through them and killing bystanders. .40 also does an excellent job and will generally penetrate light armor (car doors, house doors, etc) while the 9mm will be thwarted by some of those depending on the conditions. .45 ACP will generally penetrate just about anything below true armor. Once body armor or steel/ceramic plates are used forget about any sort of pistol round to center mass.

As far as compact autos, go try on the H&K USP compact. It's fairly concealable, is totally reliable. It shoots like butter so your hand won't feel like you've pounded nails all day when you shoot a couple hundred rounds through it. I have a .40 USP compact and I love it. It can be a little bit pricey though.

Another one is the Glock 19. Another bulletproof gun - literally. I had a Glock 19 for years and only gave it up to upgrade to the .40. That thing went through all sorts of things including saltwater, sand and some serious mud. It never let me down. It's a bit cheaper than the higher end brands too at just a hair over $500. You can chamber 9mm +P rounds in the Glock and make the ballistics near to a .40 or .357.

Also, stay away from Sig's. They are sweeeet guns, but extremely heavy and bulky. They are perfect for duty guns because they are great as supplementary weapons when empty (think pistol whip). They are some of the most accurate weapons out of the box but definitely feel their weight with limited use of polycarbonfibre.

I have heard nothing but good things about the G19 ... the only people that dont seem to like them are people who dont like the angle of the Glocks hand position.

Im going to head down to the Range after work and pick some up and feel them in my hands and maybe shoot a few and see if I can knock some off the list and narrow it down a bit.

Thanks to everyone who has replyed to this thread as you guys have been a big help!
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[Vegas_Sirk]

Originally Posted by yellowg555

How much does a good home defense shotty cost?

http://www.gunsandammomag.com/long_g...elliSN_073106/

$415 MSRP on the Benelli Supernova Tactical
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[yellowg555]

Originally Posted by M3This

I have heard nothing but good things about the G19 ... the only people that dont seem to like them are people who dont like the angle of the Glocks hand position.

Im going to head down to the Range after work and pick some up and feel them in my hands and maybe shoot a few and see if I can knock some off the list and narrow it down a bit.

Thanks to everyone who has replyed to this thread as you guys have been a big help!

You guys in Nevada have it nice with the gun laws! Ranges with assault rifles and shit! Republic of Kalifornia allows no such things.

[toofasttooslow]

Originally Posted by HyperM3

I wouldnt tell someone to stay away from a certain gun. I personally love my 228(lighter weight because of the different slide). And that gun never gets tiring no matter how long I hold it. Just because you feel the weight sooner doesnt mean the next person will. Also, most guns weigh about the same so saying one weighs more so stay away is like saying stay away from all guns. Considering you think the Sigs are heavy, I can only assume youll never own a 1911.

Just an opinion, OP is entitled to try them out if he likes. As far as most guns weighing the same? That is an asinine statement and I'll pretend you didn't say it to save you from your own embarrassment. No, I will never own a 1911. Why would I? Owning a 1911 is like saying you own a Chevy Pickup. Nice reliable gun but no imagination whatsoever. Gun technology has come a long way since then and I don't like feel like I've been hitting my hand all day with a brick. I guess it's just me but I don't feel the need to extend my penis size by carrying a over played relic. But to each their own...

[Vegas_Sirk]

Originally Posted by yellowg555

You guys in Nevada have it nice with the gun laws! Ranges with assault rifles and shit! Republic of Kalifornia allows no such things.

Yea Nevada is chill. I use to live in So Cal ... and the CC permits are gay there. .... probably one of the main reasons I only owned Shotguns when I lived there.
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[gthal]

Originally Posted by M3This

My goals for the hand gun is to a gun that is a good all around gun:

1) Accurate
2) Comfortable
3) Good For Self Defense
4) Fun To Use For Rec Shooting
5) Good for Carry & Conceal

Whats everyone that has one have? Also if you where to have just one what would you get? and what caliber ?

I have a slightly off topic question... and please forgive my ignorance! Is it legal in the US to carry a concealed gun (see #5)? Obviously, it is not in Canada but that's not relevant I guess. If it is legal, which I have to assume that it is based on this discussion, aren't you guys ever worried about cutting someone off in your car, pissing them off, and they have a GUN in their glove box???

I would be one hell of a careful driver if I lived south of the border !!

[c0nstant]

Originally Posted by ChadE

Wow thats helpful...just for future reference dont post if it dont help the OP

I know i am breaking my own rule right now as I know nothing about guns but that just bothered me.

+1