[evanevery]

Originally Posted by LuisBoston

PHEVs only have J1772, not the CCS connector or DC (Supercharger) capable.

PHEVs only make sense if you plug in everyday at home (or work), otherwise generally compromised.

PHEV's are NOT compromised. They are doing exactly as they were designed to do. ...and their usage model is different than a BEV. Yes, PHEV's don't do CCS connectors but they also don't need them.

(I'm on my 5th BEV (currently with an i7 M70 and and iX M60). But I also have a PHEV (my i8 Roadster).)

At home PHEV's are nice cause you can simply plug in their "small" battery pack to a simple 120V outlet and just let them charge overnight. So at home you get a handful of miles everyday, but you also don't need a full level 2 charger cause the battery is relatively small. ...and you always have the ICE to back you up...

On the road, they simply use (and charge) the battery for extended economy - or additional power as needed. No one is going to be plugging in a PHEV on a road trip. No need for a CCS connector...

This is the way I have been using my i8 for years now. "Trickling" On the Level 1 (120v) charger when in the garage, but never considering public charging on a road trip. (The i7 and iX are both on Level 2 chargers in the same garage)

PHEV's are pretty much irrelevant when it comes to public charger access. The battery is there if you want to charge it when at home (why not?) but nothing to worry about otherwise...

Our BEV's are our daily drivers (and we keep them charged at home). The PHEV's are nice if you want a few electric miles around town but don't want to fuss with planning public charging stops on long XC road trips where charging stations might be harder to come by. I just did a 6-day, 3700 mile XC trip to eastern Canada. I was on a tight schedule, chargers in Maine and eastern Canada are a bit sparse, and I didn't want to have to deal with any of that so I took my i8. The i8 roadster's not gonna work for two people on a long trip though so that's why I'm onboard for an M5 Touring...

BEV's for road trips with good charger coverage and PHEV's for road trips where chargers are sparse (or you want a little more flexibility).

[Scrapula]

Originally Posted by hrf

For some reason, touring profile looks much better than sedan. Sedan is disproportional like most modern bmw. I think bmw design need to do a lot of thinking why their cars are so disproportional and ugly. Also the plungin hybrid nonsense is ridiculous, I would never in my life buy plug-in hybrid, the whole idea does not make any sense and just to satisfy government regulations? Gas or good quality electric, but for me gas 100%!

I think they make a lot of sense for people who have longer drives as well as just needing to run local errands. My drives are always under 100 miles, so electric made sense for me. But, when I retire in a few years, I will have more time for road trips. I’d love to explore the Olympic Peninsula, but the only chargers are in Port Angeles at the top of the peninsula. I don’t think I would buy a second gas car just for road trips. It’s definitely something I would consider. The touring would be perfect for carrying luggage, too.

[LuisBoston]

Originally Posted by evanevery

PHEV's are NOT compromised. They are doing exactly as they are designed to perform.

I'm on my 5th BEV (currently with an i7 M70 and and iX M60). But I also have a PHEV (my i8 Roadster).

Yes, PHEV's don't do CCS connectors but they also don't need them.

At home PHEV's are nice cause you can simply plug in their "small" battery pack to a simple 120V outlet and just let them charge overnight. So at home you get a handful of miles everyday, but you also don't need a full level 2 charger cause the battery is relatively small. ...and you always have the ICE to back you up...

On the road, they simply use (and charge) the battery for extended economy - or additional power as needed. No one is going to be plugging in a PHEV on a road trip...

This is the way I have been using my i8 for years now. On the Level 1 (120v) charger when in the garage, but never considering public charging when on a road trip. (The i7 and iX are both on Level 2 chargers in the same garage)

PHEV's are pretty much a irrelevant when it comes to public charger access. The battery is there if you want to charge it when at home (why not?) but nothing to worry about otherwise...

PHEV are the worst of both worlds: short range, still need to be plugged in - a lot AND gassed up / maintained.

If most driving is handled by a 120v outlet the gas engine is unnecessary - a battery EV is fine. If you’re doing lots of 500 mile road trips in a week, you’re carrying around an electric motor and battery unnecessarily - get a regular hybrid. DCFC is generally fine for occasional long trips - it’s not 2015 or 2021 anymore.

IMO PHEVs are too burdened with compromise.

(Nice garage btw!)

[evanevery]

Originally Posted by hrf

Also the plungin hybrid nonsense is ridiculous, I would never in my life buy plug-in hybrid, the whole idea does not make any sense and just to satisfy government regulations? Gas or good quality electric, but for me gas 100%!

I'm a BEV believer, but...

PHEV's give you electric miles for errands around town (plugging in at home), increase economy on the road, and give you substantially more power when requested. ...almost 200 more HP in the case of the M5 (and substantial torque at 0 RPM)! You can also take them on longer road trips where you may not want to deal with charging challenges...

- Our Daily Driver's are BEV (i7 M70, iX M60)...

- We have a PHEV (i8 Roadster) for kicking around town and longer (single person) road trips where chargers might be an issue...and I'm onboard for an M5 Touring.

- My Track car (M4) is gas powered...

- My Tow vehicle (GMS Sierra Denali) is a diesel...

I don't know why so many people think this has to be a zero-sum gain? BEV's don't have to "lose" so PHEV's or ICE vehicles can "win". Each type of vehicle has strengths and weaknesses. You can like both Apples and Oranges, its "OK"!

If you like cars, you can like ***ALL*** different kinds of cars. Not sure why folks are so tribal about this...

[evanevery]

Originally Posted by LuisBoston

PHEV are the worst of both worlds: short range, still need to be plugged in - a lot AND gassed up / maintained.

(Nice garage btw!)

I don't think you understand how they work. PHEV's don't NEED to be plugged in - EVER!

I did my entire Euro Delivery on the i8 without plugging in. I also just did a 3700 mile road trip in the i8 and never needed to plug in.

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by hrf

For some reason, touring profile looks much better than sedan. Sedan is disproportional like most modern bmw. I think bmw design need to do a lot of thinking why their cars are so disproportional and ugly. Also the plungin hybrid nonsense is ridiculous, I would never in my life buy plug-in hybrid, the whole idea does not make any sense and just to satisfy government regulations? Gas or good quality electric, but for me gas 100%!

Each to their own, but for me it makes 100% sense.
As others have pointed out in this thread, most of the daily driving chores are well within the EV range of this new model.
Saying it makes no sense, it’s nonsense and ridiculous, is a pretty narrow minded comment.
I’m not going to buy tech like this for the government, I’ll buy it for me (if it suits my needs)
Yes, you could choose two cars and make them do the job of one, that makes sense…

[yousefnjr]

Originally Posted by Alan l.

Exactly why I’m interested in the M5 Touring.

I drive my kids to school almost every morning that’s only 5mins away. Starting my car in the morning is a pain because it’s loud and the cold starts wastes a ton of fuel. During the day I’m the one that picks them up and drives them around to sports activities all also 5-10mins away. Considering I’m not taking the car far I still need to spend $70-$80 on gas every week.

For these types of drives im not hauling ass around my town so there isn’t a need to fire up the engine. This is a huge benefit with the new M5 vs my current X5MC

I’m in the same boat with all these short trips. I also run an ethanol blend, and driving without getting the oil up to temp is especially brutal. It’d be great to sidestep that problem entirely and only use fuel when papa wants to play.

[evanevery]

Our first electric car was a Chevy Volt (PHEV). It had about a 44 mile electric only range. We used it as our Daily Driver and it would KILL us if we ran out of juice (and the ICE would engage). That limited 44 mile range effectively worked for us almost 100% of the time. I certainly wouldn't have pressed the car so far on electric only if it didn't have a ICE to fall back on. (Fun fact: The Volt would REQUIRE us to run at least 1/2 tank of gas through the car every 6 months in any case - to keep the fuel fresh).

Anyway, its pretty amazing how effective 40 miles or so can be if you simply keep the car plugged in all the time (even on Level 1 120V).

It was that PHEV that helped us understand what OUR daily range requirements really were. The nice thing was it always had the ICE in reserve if we underestimated our needs.

A PHEV can help many people understand the potential of a pure BEV (and their personal requirements). Folks will getter better appreciation for their range requirements. People can also find out how much more CONVENIENT an electric vehicle can be as a daily driver. Maybe a first step for some...

(Also don't discount how much less planning/coordination is involved on long XC Road Trips with a PHEV vs a BEV...)

[BMthusiast]

Sheesh.

[Autoaddict]

Originally Posted by Alan l.

Exactly why I’m interested in the M5 Touring.

I drive my kids to school almost every morning that’s only 5mins away. Starting my car in the morning is a pain because it’s loud and the cold starts wastes a ton of fuel. During the day I’m the one that picks them up and drives them around to sports activities all also 5-10mins away. Considering I’m not taking the car far I still need to spend $70-$80 on gas every week.

For these types of drives im not hauling ass around my town so there isn’t a need to fire up the engine. This is a huge benefit with the new M5 vs my current X5MC

I agree. Driving kids around and just other mundane in town trips just sucks up gas but having the option to vary power, either IC+EV or just EV, is a great flex. Could careless on weight. When I’m driving the M3, I’m never thinking I wish this was lighter then a GT3.

[LuisBoston]

Originally Posted by evanevery

I don't think you understand how they work. PHEV's don't NEED to be plugged in - EVER!

I did my entire Euro Delivery on the i8 without plugging in. I also just did a 3700 mile road trip in the i8 and never needed to plug in.

To get the full benefit of them (ie all-EV driving around town), they (mainstream PHEVs) should be plugged in everyday.

[hrf]

Originally Posted by LuisBoston

PHEV are the worst of both worlds: short range, still need to be plugged in - a lot AND gassed up / maintained.

If most driving is handled by a 120v outlet the gas engine is unnecessary - a battery EV is fine. If you’re doing lots of 500 mile road trips in a week, you’re carrying around an electric motor and battery unnecessarily - get a regular hybrid. DCFC is generally fine for occasional long trips - it’s not 2015 or 2021 anymore.

IMO PHEVs are too burdened with compromise.

(Nice garage btw!)

100% agree PHEV makes no sense at all

[hrf]

Originally Posted by Custom Install

Each to their own, but for me it makes 100% sense.
As others have pointed out in this thread, most of the daily driving chores are well within the EV range of this new model.
Saying it makes no sense, it’s nonsense and ridiculous, is a pretty narrow minded comment.
I’m not going to buy tech like this for the government, I’ll buy it for me (if it suits my needs)
Yes, you could choose two cars and make them do the job of one, that makes sense…

Very narro minded to choose PHEV over electric or gas. You have twice the problems of electric and gas.

[TXSchnee]

Originally Posted by hrf

Very narro minded to choose PHEV over electric or gas. You have twice the problems of electric and gas.

This isn’t true, at all. Have had 4 PHEVs and one BEV, all other vehicles ICE. It seems that those with zero PHEV or BEV ownership are the ones yelling loudest about how awful they are.

[Igor_M5]

Originally Posted by hrf

For some reason, touring profile looks much better than sedan. Sedan is disproportional like most modern bmw. I think bmw design need to do a lot of thinking why their cars are so disproportional and ugly. Also the plungin hybrid nonsense is ridiculous, I would never in my life buy plug-in hybrid, the whole idea does not make any sense and just to satisfy government regulations? Gas or good quality electric, but for me gas 100%!

It’s the outer taillights that give me a sour taste for the Sedans :/ like… wtf is up with that random ass shape. At least the touring outters follow some design pattern with 2/3/8 series.

[evanevery]

Originally Posted by LuisBoston

To get the full benefit of them (ie all-EV driving around town), they (mainstream PHEVs) should be plugged in everyday.

THE POINT IS:

Yes, but you simply don't HAVE to if its not convenient.

If you can, then GREAT! ...but if you can not (or don't want to deal with the planning), then you simply don't have to! You don't HAVE to plug in a PHEV at all - or ever.

So, my original response to PHEV's "NEED to be plugged in" is still "NO"...

PHEV's can run on electric around town (for shorter trips) and still be completely immune to charging challenges on long XC road trips...

[GOLFFRR]

need one of these also! black on black

[danniexi]

Originally Posted by Alan l.

Exactly why I’m interested in the M5 Touring.

I drive my kids to school almost every morning that’s only 5mins away. Starting my car in the morning is a pain because it’s loud and the cold starts wastes a ton of fuel. During the day I’m the one that picks them up and drives them around to sports activities all also 5-10mins away. Considering I’m not taking the car far I still need to spend $70-$80 on gas every week.

For these types of drives im not hauling ass around my town so there isn’t a need to fire up the engine. This is a huge benefit with the new M5 vs my current X5MC

100% this. my daily driving routine consists of the school run and the drive to the train station to commute to work. the electric only range of 25 miles is perfect for around town driving. this car would 100% suit my needs.

now if only i had $150K lying around...

[brianeck]

Interior choices definitely leave a little something to be desired. No brown, khaki, tan, camel, tartufo etc.

Basically its white, black, or neon.

I know individual will be coming and all that, but like some kind of midtone launch color would be nice! Never in my life have I looked at an interior color palette and thought "black looks the best" until now.

[rockitman07]

Originally Posted by brianeck

Interior choices definitely leave a little something to be desired. No brown, khaki, tan, camel, tartufo etc.

Basically its white, black, or neon.

I know individual will be coming and all that, but like some kind of midtone launch color would be nice! Never in my life have I looked at an interior color palette and thought "black looks the best" until now.

Yeah, I'm dumbfounded by the sparse choices. At a minimum we know the "violet/black" individual is coming but I'm hoping to see a Tartufo option without the black uppers that these standard colors are using. You can barely see any of the colorful options on the exterior views. I realize perspective will be different walking up to the car but still.

[BimmerBoy123]

Originally Posted by evanevery

I've got an order already assembled. Just waiting for my allocation...

Fully optioned with Techno Violet (individual paint) and Dark Violet/Black Merino (individual leather). The SOP for the individual interior is 3/25 but I will wait for it...

Is the Dark Violet/Black Merino interior Full Leather (dash, console and door panels)? Thinking of doing Speed Yellow and Full Leather Black interior if it’s possible.

[ST3]

Originally Posted by wishbone

Maybe I don't get this but is there not going to be a competition package or is that something that might come later.

I see the M Drive professional option however, that just seems like software?

Just curious.

Everyone seems to either not be aware or have a short memory that the F90, when first released, did not have a competition package available. Also, the F90 comp package was a small bump in HP with same torque. The rest was cosmetic with killer wheels and a questionable better exhaust setup.