[Billup]

Originally Posted by Nkc

I'm still stuck on the win-loose deal. I prefer the tight-win.

Me too. This whole time I thought the world was a win-tight or win-win kind of deal, so now that I've learned it's a win-loose...., guess I just need to start fisting all the girls I date.

[CANGRKE70]

Originally Posted by Billup

guess I just need to start fisting all the girls I date.

[Whostheboss]

Originally Posted by Revartr

I understand where you're coming from, and I'm well aware that world is never really a win-win, which is why I almost always carefully weigh my decisions before making them. However, I thoroughly do not believe that I am sacrificing any amount of respect in any way, shape, or form, by having such a close female friend. I've always had a good mix of close male and female friends, the slight majority of which being female (some of whom I've ended up hooking up with, one example of which was discussed in another thread not too long ago), but it has never affected my chances of dating/hooking up with other girls. I can thoroughly enjoy the company of a girl in a completely platonic manner, just the same as I can enjoy the company of a girl in a completely intimate manner if I'm interested in her like that. If I just wanted to hook up with or date my best friend, I would've played it completely differently. But that's not what I was after, and those weren't my intentions. Don't get me wrong, I am a nice guy, but I'm not a pushover, and I'm a confident bastard. I still have my fair share of hook-ups and have never had a problem finding a date, but I still have plenty of close female friends. Sometimes those end up interlapping, but in this case her and I are just friends.

OK, cool. As long as the female friends aren't hurting your sex/dating life.

[NEFARIOUS]

Too many to list, but this is one of them...

TL/DR: Started breaking out of the friendzone, my mom sabotaged it as much as possible, then literally killed all attraction to me when she pulled a knife on the girl I was seeing, and my mom tried to steal from me.

Sorry if this is long, but the devil is in the details and I haven't really figured out how to condense it.

So, thanks to a traumatically fouled upbringing with a crazy mom with all signs of Cluster B, I sought group therapy and various seminars, things started turning around for me: I got over being socially awkward, started a business with my friend, it became almost too successful and I was able to buy a house (another story), and I started finally having a girl like me; we'll call her "Sally" for anonymity... Very pretty girl with a good head on her shoulders, very caring and nurturing. Then... It all came crashing down when my mom called from a local number.

Instead of telling me ahead of time [why?], she waits she's already in the US for a month to tell me that her friend's mom got Alzheimer's, but if she knew what was going on (since she only reveals the ugly side to family) I'd doubt mother would even get hired. Even worse? That friend doesn't live too far away, which enabled her to walk over and cook or "clean the house" (read: rearranging the house to conceal stealing from me). Despite my busy schedule, she had priorities to my free time on Sunday.

Where does Sally fit in? We've known each other for 2 years as just platonic friends, but she was in a relationship... 3 months after her breakup, she started talking to me, we started to develop feelings, but she was afraid of "affecting our friendship" halfway through making out .

Just my crappy luck, mother's patient became vegetative and needed a skilled nurse, so my mom was laid off, but never told me and moved herself in without telling me... She almost got killed by a Rottweiler and almost got arrested, but that's another story for another time (though it's schadenfreude heaven).

Coincidentally, Sally wanted to break the friend wall again, but that news came when mother wanted to go on a tour of NorCal.

After I came back, Sally invites me to a countryside bed & breakfast (girls don't invite platonic friends to those, right?)... So, we're 20 miles out, and my mom calls 5× pretending she lost her keys and manipulated me into driving back, turning it into a "meet the parents". Instead of edifying me, she humiliated me until the trip was ruined, prompting Sally to cancel the reservation... But when she finally heard my side of the story and realized "Kim Mom Ill" was only spewing psychobabble and half of it didn't fit my character, all we did was go on the apple-picking part of the plan since the B&B was now fully booked, and she wasn't quite in the mood to spend the night with me.

Then, mother strikes again and wants to go to Vegas, and is flying back to Taiwan the next week and forces a plane ticket in my hand just when business is picking up, but again, blackmail + no excuses. Plus are you noticing not telling me important details or doing things affecting me without my permission as a trend?

So, 2 days before the flight leaves, Sally sends me a selfie of her in lingerie and wants to meet up, but my mom somehow knew I wanted to see her, but purposely occupied my entire day by having me drive her all over the place, and even humiliated me in Costco by loudly yelling about her.

Then, she tells me to pack lightly since she plans to buy me clothes, then suddenly whips out the silent treatment (another fave) and refuses to leave the car (3rd time in my life) until she made me promise her I'd stay home despite the fact that our flight wasn't until 3PM the next day, plenty of time to see Sally and come back. I go upstairs to pack and I'm done in 3 minutes, but find my inflatable mattress in the hallway; yes, she's going THAT far to cockblock me. I call Sally about my misfortune and she painfully tells me she'll miss me, but she still surprises me and comes over dressed in her that nightie underneath normal clothes, then we make out like crazy and guides my hand down and [XXX/NSFW content truncated].

Then my mom, true to her psychotic nature, instead of nicely saying I don't spend enough time with her (despite the fact that she's been living in my house for almost a month [i]and[i] I eke out every Sunday I can for her), she'd bottle it up until it explodes with threats of death, suicide or serious harm... She darts into the kitchen and waves a bread knife in Sally's face saying "listen you cunt, I don't want you around my son anymore. If I find you with him one more time, I'm going to kill you, are we clear?"

So Sally freaks out and drives off as I'm restraining my mom, then I bolt out in a cloud of burnt rubber myself since I was so pissed, I didn't even close my garage door (thank God nothing went missing since mother didn't even bother to close it either). Since Sally still lived at home, we talked in my car until we both fell asleep, and I was too out of it to get a motel. She called my dad (since she managed to somehow befriend him), and this night, 5 people: 2 friends, my dad and even (I'm not making this up) a psychic called me "sensing danger". My dad knew she feared the government but has no common respect, so he persuaded us to call the cops on her, but neither me nor Sally pressed charges since she was leaving in a matter of hours.

Then the day after: Sally did say she liked me a lot, but is afraid for her life if she has to deal with my mom again, and hanging out was never the same and we just grew apart. Even worse? I'm glad my mom still had a suitcase over as storage, but glad I inspected it; I found lapel pins, Sally's earrings, a perfume set I was intending to gift, other valuables, and my Tag Heuer watch rolled up and tucked away inside a blouse... And also a 24K gold ring that was so unwieldy big, I only wore it on special occasions was gone. But seriously, who the fuzzuck steals from their own son?

Oh, and there was another incident where she tried to jump out of my car, but I already made too damned long a post for the previous incident.

[BMW F22]

^ no offense but you have/had a very fucked up relationship with the woman you called mom. Reading that post is disheartening and scary...

[NEFARIOUS]

Originally Posted by BMW F22

^ no offense but you have/had a very fucked up relationship with the woman you called mom. Reading that post is disheartening and scary...

You have no idea... I still admire my dad to this day for letting me have the childhood he never had; his dad left his mom at an early age and was abusive to both him and his grandma, so he stuck around until it was inhumanely ridiculous and divorced when I was 7 (instead of killing himself when I was 6... Thank God his friend talked him into staying alive when he was saying his goodbyes), especially when the counselor (esp. one that operated a fairly large firm in San Francisco; we lived in NorCal at the time) that diagnosed my mom said to my dad "Look, Mr. W*. I've been doing this line of work for 25 years, and my job is to save marriages and help couples optimistically. However, your wife has the worst case of antisocial disorder and passive-aggressiveness I've ever seen, and your case is the only one out of once every 5 years out of all the patients I see, where I can only think of where divorce as a solution since things probably won't get any better, not to mention from what little I can gather before she gave me the silent treatment, she thinks there's nothing wrong with her behavior."

Fast forward to today, I know it sounds cruel to say this about the flesh and blood that made me, but instead of the times that I see other people's mothers and see them very close, loving and nurturing, I have to be very strategic and actually have to keep my mom at arm's distance, because she alternates without warning... One moment, she's cooking my favorite meals, the other moment, she's scheming behind my back to do something for her benefit at my expense, and sadly, the latter is more common than the former.

If things are so bad that you have to limit her to using LINE (an IM client) to communicate and use a private mailbox as your "address" since giving her your real information puts you at jeopardy, you know you have a problem.

If you've actually upgraded your bedroom and home office door and lock to be better protected than even your front door (as in your doors are made out of metal, your deadbolt has 4 bolts and the key is made with pick-resistant pits instead of a sawtooth pattern while your front door is just a solid wooden door with a standard Schlage lock), bought a safe, kept a gun loaded in a bedside fingerprint-controlled safe not because of a random intruder but because she literally have tried to take your life when you were 3 (but thank God I didn't bleed out), stolen from you, and tried to take your soon-to-be girlfriend's (or God-willing, even wife's) life, and have CCTV all over (too bad I had to sell that house 4 months after my mom left), you know you have a problem.

If one small reason you got a BMW is because a double-pull door is harder to pull open when shit hits the fan and she wants to jump out of a moving car for the 3rd time in her life (but since she likes BMWs too it's hard to say if she knows of that feature), and you're even pondering how accepting she may be of you putting her in the back seat and engaging the child safety locks, you know you have a problem.

If you'd trust a significant other, friends, one night stand or even the cable guy being at your house unattended much, much more than your own mother, you know you have a problem.

If you have to make false promises about visiting her just to prevent her from messing things up on your side of the pond when you are otherwise so brutally honest, you even have no apprehensions about telling your life story on Bimmerpost, you know you have a problem.

[bimmette]

Originally Posted by NEFARIOUS

You have no idea... I still admire my dad to this day for letting me have the childhood he never had; his dad left his mom at an early age and was abusive to both him and his grandma, so he stuck around until it was inhumanely ridiculous and divorced when I was 7 (instead of killing himself when I was 6... Thank God his friend talked him into staying alive when he was saying his goodbyes), especially when the counselor that diagnosed my mom said "Look, Mr. W. I've been doing this line of work for 25 years, and my job is to save marriages and help couples optimistically. However, your wife has the worst case of antisocial disorder and passive-aggressiveness I've ever seen, and I can only think of divorce as a solution since things probably won't get any better, not to mention from what little I can gather before she gave me the silent treatment, she thinks there's nothing wrong with her behavior."

Fast forward to today, I know it sounds cruel to say this about the flesh and blood that made me, but instead of the times that I see other people's mothers and see them very close, loving and nurturing, I have to be very strategic and actually have to keep my mom at arm's distance, because she alternates without warning... One moment, she's cooking my favorite meals, the other moment, she's scheming behind my back to do something for her benefit at my expense, and sadly, the latter is more common than the former.

If things are so bad that you have to limit her to using LINE (an IM client) to communicate and use a private mailbox as your "address" since giving her your real information puts you at jeopardy, you know you have a problem.

If you've actually upgraded your bedroom and home office door and lock to be better protected than even your front door (as in your doors are made out of metal, your deadbolt has 4 bolts and the key is made with pick-resistant pits instead of a sawtooth pattern while your front door is just a solid wooden door with a standard Schlage lock), bought a safe, kept a gun loaded in a bedside fingerprint-controlled safe not because of a random intruder but because she literally have tried to take your life when you were 3 (but thank God I didn't bleed out), stolen from you, and tried to take your soon-to-be girlfriend's (or God-willing, even wife's) life, and have CCTV all over (too bad I had to sell that house 4 months after my mom left), you know you have a problem.

If one small reason you got a BMW is because a double-pull door is harder to pull open when shit hits the fan and she wants to jump out of a moving car for the 3rd time in her life (but since she likes BMWs too it's hard to say if she knows of that feature), and you're even pondering how accepting she may be of you putting her in the back seat and engaging the child safety locks, you know you have a problem.

If you'd trust a significant other, friends, one night stand or even the cable guy being at your house unattended much, much more than your own mother, you know you have a problem.

If you have to make false promises about visiting her just to prevent her from messing things up on your side of the pond when you are otherwise so brutally honest, you even have no apprehensions about telling your life story on Bimmerpost, you know you have a problem.

I mean this in the nicest way, Nef: When you can afford it, seek professional counselling.

[Nkc]

When is Nef ever gonna get a break.

[Lups]

Nef I agree with bimmette. Nobody survives a childhood like that without so much fucked up stuff floating in their heads ready to ruin relationships.

[NEFARIOUS]

Well, here's the thing, and remember how I said the devil is in the detail? The series of seminars was a large group awareness therapy (Lifespring), and despite what people say about it online, it worked wonders. However, the instructor / head psychologist agreed that incident started a new wave of trauma and granted 50% off the 2nd visit.

That incident itself doesn't bother me anymore, I'm just showing the folks at home how bad it could get, and people on here know me for telling it like it is, so I delivered on that. Still, I am thinking of returning a 3rd time since my dad's death and the worst financial ruins I've ever experienced has kinda brought me down (and I grew up poor), but I don't think anything will work, whether it's that or even a traditional therapy session. Why? What still bothers me and may still bother me in the future is the fact that I have to deal with those kind of situations until either she has some sort of epiphany/major event that'll change HER evil ways (because again, she still thinks everything is all gumdrops and ice cream).

As an IT Tech, the best analogy is this: In a perfect world, we wouldn't need antiviruses, firewalls, or even implemented security procedures and can use our computers without worries of ruining your life... But yet, we actually have to keep such aspects around just so you don't get screwed by a hacker. As in, I can change my side and reactions all the livelong day until the worst possible life situation becomes a walk in the park, but it's still unfortunate that I would have to keep a tinge of doubt in the back of my mind not because of paranoia or psychosis, but because I have no choice but to not trust my own mother 100% since she'll just walk in and take advantage of that loophole like a hacker. If this was a toxic friend or some random tinfoil hat-wearing maniac at the local insane asylum, I could just boot them out of my life, but what makes this truly unfortunate is that it's my mom we're talking about, and if you can genuinely have psychologists you encountered to see things your way, or have a marriage counselor tell your dad to divorce, you know you have a problem.

[davis449]

Not the worst experience I've ever had with people, but it's the one that came to me the quickest.

I was in a private school from 4th-8th grade. 7th grade year some new scholarship kids come in (this already sounds snot-nosed, that's not me, I'm just setting the scene in a literal tone to create the picture of the environment I was stuck in at the time). I befriend a guy named "Jeff". Me and "Jeff" become fast friends because, even though I had been going to the school for a number of years, I was an outsider just like him. My parents' were upper middle class, but these kids were Uber effing rich and had attitudes to match. Like I said previously, that's not me, that's not who I am, nor how I was raised by my parents. He was protective of me and I provided him with true friendship in a place where everyone wanted to be cool with him, but not his friend. Because being a public school kid, he was feared by the rich little assholes.

So the following year he's back in public school and we remain and become closer friends. By 9th grade, I'm out of that hell hole of a school and in public school for freshman through senior year where we get some good opportunities to take some revenge on those who followed suit transferring out of that private school into our public H.S. after their Freshman years (my town had Freshman-only schools due to class sizes vs. drop out rates and NO ONE wanted to go to them, not even me so I came to find out). Now I'll skip the many other stories I could tell that showed the signs of what was to come by simply stating that, upon many reflections over the years, he was always a friend when it served him best though he claimed we were like "brothers". His true, "brother", was another real piece of shit we all hung out with who's gotten him into more trouble (even up until recent times) than I could tell in a book about the subject...so I'd say they deserve each other.

So it's March 2001, I'm 19, and it's been about a month after breaking up with a H.S. GF I'd been dating for about a year and half. Not carrying any guilt from that, just looking for someone else. I meet that someone else. "Beth" is 16 and gorgeous. I mean way out my league looks-wise, but she likes me a lot. Doesn't matter. We start dating.

Now, at this point I have to side track a just a tad. "Jeff" was a ladies man. He was one of those "any girl, anytime, anywhere" types. He could get it. Don't really think there's any further, needless explanation\story needed here because we all know the type. I also have to mention that I met this girl through a separate group of friends that I had. These two groups, the one "Jeff" was a member of and the one that I met this girl through, were separate for quite sometime. Not on purpose, it was just that the group of friends I had met this girl through were mostly dropouts by senior year and the group that included "Jeff" were not. So they didn't mix, even after H.S., for quite some time.

I had misgivings about introducing this girl to "Jeff", due to the obvious. I had told him she was gorgeous and when he saw her for the first time, he gave me the respect, but the look in his eye was undeniable. It was only a matter of time, and I knew it. There was no way in hell I was ever going to have the hot girl and he not. I got a way too close way too fast to "Beth" and, after coming from a long relationship, it freaked me out a little bit. I was headed off to college in August, presumably, to rarely return, so by June I had broken it off (in a very stupid way I won't get into) and taken a job in the oil field that had me running back and forth between Midland and Lubbock. I needed to make the money that job paid and bank it before I started college where I knew I wouldn't have a job for a while until I got established in San Antonio.

I came home far more than I thought I would over the next year, but we didn't really see each other. After two semesters at St. Mary's Univ. (a place I really didn't want to go in a city I did want to be in), I had to call it quits. I had a degree\career path I wanted to follow and when I came home, I talked to my parents about doing exactly what I should've done in the first place and they finally agreed. So I was to be home for two more years to finish my Associates before heading off to UTSA, where I wanted to go originally after completing my Associates right out of H.S., to finish my Bachelors. My reappearance coupled with the fact that both of those groups of friends were all past H.S. caused them to merge.

As far as I knew "Jeff" and "Beth" had no contact during the time I was gone, but as these two groups merged, "Beth" came back into the picture. Though she had become, like every good West Texas girl, a lot more "experienced" since I had left, we very quickly started looking at each other the way had about a year and a half previous. But after a month of lengthy talks about it, she called it off. She had more "exploring" to do, and I knew that August 2004 would arrive eventually and I would be gone for good, save for visiting my parents. I was headed from college to a another big city in TX no matter what, even if it was the very one I finished college in (well...here I am). Everyone knew this was going on so it wasn't a secret, and almost as if on cue "Jeff" started making his move. He knew how I felt about her. He did it anyway, as if to prove a point to me. Not only that, but he set it up perfectly to make sure I caught them, in the act, in my parents fucking house at a party I was throwing. She fell for his bullshit easy. He tore her up SO bad emotionally, too, over the next year or so. I moved on. When they broke up she went into slut overdrive and we rarely saw her. I don't think I really ever did see her after sometime in 2003. The few times I went back home between 2004 and 2011 (no real reason to go "home" when you're parents pack up and leave "home" 2 mos. after you're gone ) I was filled in by the friends I stayed with few details of her life, where she worked in town, etc. Most of which I do not, honestly, remember.

About six months ago, "Beth" found me on FB. She filled in some of the blanks for me... apparently it all "ended" pretty bad for her around 2008. Emotional and physical abuse by a significant other to say the least, the details of which aren't worth telling here. She's now married (to a guy who seems pretty good), a bit church crazy (good because that got her out of her bad situation), doing MLM bullshit, and has two kids. A typical dead end West Texas girl, overall. Kinda sad. We're friendly now, and that's ok because she's 320 miles away and knows I'm not coming back.

"Jeff", well, due to his crap father, shitty choices in business partners, and (most recently) true "brother" I mentioned previously has faced financial ruin more than once. I saw him a few times in 2009 as he was making his way through SA on oil field equipment runs down to the Eagle Ford play south of the city. He's miserably married now (within the last two years), is pretty broke, and has two boys. He always said that deep down he wanted to be a family man...well, I guess he got what he wanted.

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by NEFARIOUS

Well, here's the thing, and remember how I said the devil is in the detail? The series of seminars was a large group awareness therapy (Lifespring), and despite what people say about it online, it worked wonders. However, the instructor / head psychologist agreed that incident started a new wave of trauma and granted 50% off the 2nd visit.

That incident itself doesn't bother me anymore, I'm just showing the folks at home how bad it could get, and people on here know me for telling it like it is, so I delivered on that. Still, I am thinking of returning a 3rd time since my dad's death and the worst financial ruins I've ever experienced has kinda brought me down (and I grew up poor), but I don't think anything will work, whether it's that or even a traditional therapy session. Why? What still bothers me and may still bother me in the future is the fact that I have to deal with those kind of situations until either she has some sort of epiphany/major event that'll change HER evil ways (because again, she still thinks everything is all gumdrops and ice cream).

As an IT Tech, the best analogy is this: In a perfect world, we wouldn't need antiviruses, firewalls, or even implemented security procedures and can use our computers without worries of ruining your life... But yet, we actually have to keep such aspects around just so you don't get screwed by a hacker. As in, I can change my side and reactions all the livelong day until the worst possible life situation becomes a walk in the park, but it's still unfortunate that I would have to keep a tinge of doubt in the back of my mind not because of paranoia or psychosis, but because I have no choice but to not trust my own mother 100% since she'll just walk in and take advantage of that loophole like a hacker. If this was a toxic friend or some random tinfoil hat-wearing maniac at the local insane asylum, I could just boot them out of my life, but what makes this truly unfortunate is that it's my mom we're talking about, and if you can genuinely have psychologists you encountered to see things your way, or have a marriage counselor tell your dad to divorce, you know you have a problem.

Nef, man I didn't know it was that bad..
But you might have to reach a point where you DO have to cut her out of your life, or at least put it on hold so you can physically and financially get yourself together first. As you know there is no way she will do anything willingly so even if you are all each other has.
Or you might want to try 'acting'.. which is basically being your same old self, but knowing all her BS and talking preemptive and behind the scenes actions so that they do not affect you. Basically you are the adult now and you treat her like a child, tricking her lying etc.
You just have to know that YOU are right, and she is fucked up.. once this is certain to you, you can manage her no matter how messed up she becomes.

The hard part is trusting yourself and not her, basically all children are brainwashed zombies of their parents - they just don't realize it, because the programing is so deep and so subtle.

Remember, KNOW she is fucked up, and you ARE NOT. You have to actually see this as the truth. Then everything else (alot) falls in place.

One simple truth, but very hard in practice to make it a reality.

[NEFARIOUS]

Originally Posted by grimlock

Nef, man I didn't know it was that bad..
But you might have to reach a point where you DO have to cut her out of your life, or at least put it on hold so you can physically and financially get yourself together first. As you know there is no way she will do anything willingly so even if you are all each other has.
Or you might want to try 'acting'.. which is basically being your same old self, but knowing all her BS and talking preemptive and behind the scenes actions so that they do not affect you. Basically you are the adult now and you treat her like a child, tricking her lying etc.
You just have to know that YOU are right, and she is fucked up.. once this is certain to you, you can manage her no matter how messed up she becomes.

The hard part is trusting yourself and not her, basically all children are brainwashed zombies of their parents - they just don't realize it, because the programing is so deep and so subtle.

Remember, KNOW she is fucked up, and you ARE NOT. You have to actually see this as the truth. Then everything else (alot) falls in place.

One simple truth, but very hard in practice to make it a reality.

Thanks. You're right about the brainwashed zombies part... Actually the marriage counselor told my dad that he theorized that it's because of her upbringing in a refugee military family; her dad was a high-ranked officer in the military, and probably used to people catering to her and her dad's respect, but even though it's more likely out of rank than it is a genuine, heartfelt one, but it created a sense of having the world at her feet (but the funny thing is her younger brothers and sisters turned out just fine). Both the marriage counselor and a psychologist have agreed that acting in agreement WAS actually the only way to deal with her for the short-term, but glad that the only time I have to do this is when she crosses over to the US, and even then it's prone to backfiring since she is often 3 steps ahead of everything I conjure.

I have actually tried without long-lasting success to cut her out many of times due to one traumatic event after the other when she finds ways to contact me 3-5 years later... Family friends, Intelius-type services, even messaging people on my FB friends list. She has a high IQ, but sadly it's not put to good use, only to outwit everyone. I think the only way to cut her out 100% is for me to ditch to a different country and rename myself.

Trust me, it's not easy having to pretend everything is fine when it's not, then having to clean up the damage once she's gone, as if I've encountered a tornado. Reconciling with friendships broken in her name, turning the whole house upside down and reorganizing things to my specs (and of course noticing things missing), even donating clothes I was borderline forced to wear that looks simply retarded (and that's coming from someone whose fashion sense sucks).

Either way, I'm glad she was mostly absent from my life when she usurped me to Taiwan, and told me on multiple occasions (even calmly) that she only brought me here just to piss my dad off, and I was raised by my grandma and my encounters were when she didn't have to lead a tour (she was a tour guide) or when I'm up past my bedtime since she's usually home late or briefly in the morning (but usually still trying to wake up since she takes forever to be on alert)... So I'm glad my upbringing was mostly in the ideal of my grandma and my dad, and even my grandma warned me about following her footsteps too closely.

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by NEFARIOUS

Thanks. You're right about the brainwashed zombies part... Actually the marriage counselor told my dad that he theorized that it's because of her upbringing in a refugee military family; her dad was a high-ranked officer in the military, and probably used to people catering to her and her dad's respect, but even though it's more likely out of rank than it is a genuine, heartfelt one, but it created a sense of having the world at her feet (but the funny thing is her younger brothers and sisters turned out just fine). Both the marriage counselor and a psychologist have agreed that acting in agreement WAS actually the only way to deal with her for the short-term, but glad that the only time I have to do this is when she crosses over to the US, and even then it's prone to backfiring since she is often 3 steps ahead of everything I conjure.

I have actually tried without long-lasting success to cut her out many of times due to one traumatic event after the other when she finds ways to contact me 3-5 years later... Family friends, Intelius-type services, even messaging people on my FB friends list. She has a high IQ, but sadly it's not put to good use, only to outwit everyone. I think the only way to cut her out 100% is for me to ditch to a different country and rename myself.

Trust me, it's not easy having to pretend everything is fine when it's not, then having to clean up the damage once she's gone, as if I've encountered a tornado. Reconciling with friendships broken in her name, turning the whole house upside down and reorganizing things to my specs (and of course noticing things missing), even donating clothes I was borderline forced to wear that looks simply retarded (and that's coming from someone whose fashion sense sucks).

Either way, I'm glad she was mostly absent from my life when she usurped me to Taiwan, and told me on multiple occasions (even calmly) that she only brought me here just to piss my dad off, and I was raised by my grandma and my encounters were when she didn't have to lead a tour (she was a tour guide) or when I'm up past my bedtime since she's usually home late or briefly in the morning (but usually still trying to wake up since she takes forever to be on alert)... So I'm glad my upbringing was mostly in the ideal of my grandma and my dad, and even my grandma warned me about following her footsteps too closely.

Seems like she gets her kicks for making u feel bad.
Grandparents are part of the web..
U mentioned various diagnosies, but I didn't hear narcissist

[BMW F22]

Do your posts have to be so long so often Nef? Sometimes I want to read them but don't because of those walls of text (especially on a phone).

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by BMW F22

Do your posts have to be so long so often Nef? Sometimes I want to read them but don't because of those walls of text (especially on a phone).

basically his mom is a bitch

[BMW F22]

Originally Posted by grimlock

basically his mom is a bitch

Yeah I can see that. More like a psychological issue than anything. But still, holy walls of text Batman!

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by BMW F22

Yeah I can see that. More like a psychological issue than anything. But still, holy walls of text Batman!

well u have to give the bitch some flavor..

[F30lolz]

Originally Posted by grimlock

basically his mom is a bitch

I'll play somewhat.

My mom is a bitch too. Just because we bumped heads over a year ago she refuses to talk/even see her own grandson AND we live not even a mile apart. Grandparents are supposed to cherish grandchildren, yet my own mother wants to look the other way. Me personally, we've had our issue's over the past twenty years, fine. But to take it out on my son? Fuck her.

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by fleeked

I fucking had this grape smelling condom on the other night...

Talk about flavor...I wanted to suck my own pee pee after taking a whiff of that

but then u fed it to that monster... grape eating monster

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by F30lolz

I'll play somewhat.

My mom is a bitch too. Just because we bumped heads over a year ago she refuses to talk/even see her own grandson AND we live not even a mile apart. Grandparents are supposed to cherish grandchildren, yet my own mother wants to look the other way. Me personally, we've had our issue's over the past twenty years, fine. But to take it out on my son? Fuck her.

u can't change anyone.. my mom doesn't talk to me either (but it just started recently). maybe she is old enough to stop acting when u stood up to her, it's her rules or she's not going to play
I don't know what I'm going to do.. maybe accept that u r two different ppl and u can't make someone give u love

[F30lolz]

Originally Posted by grimlock

u can't change anyone.. my mom doesn't talk to me either (but it just started recently). maybe she is old enough to stop acting when u stood up to her, it's her rules or she's not going to play
I don't know what I'm going to do.. maybe accept that u r two different ppl and u can't make someone give u love

Am I bothered by it? Yes I am, though where you two very close in your youth? The way I look at life is why bother trying to change someone to care/love you or your loved ones when they don't even try/love in return? Its been maybe 15 months since I've last heard of her and I just continue on with my days as before. My son doesn't even ask about her so he isn't the one missing out. Are you close to your father at least?