[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by upsidedownfunnel

You said the Supra is a "dead ringer" for the F30 and that BMW was using "leftover" parts for the Supra. Literally the only part that might be the same are the steering wheel control buttons. The steering wheel clearly has a more sculpted shape. The lower trim goes into the wheel on the Supra while the old F30 wheel goes up to meet the trim. The wheel is definitely a different part, no question.

Again, can you show where the Supra is using "leftover" BMW parts and how it's a dead ringer?

The center of the steering wheel is from the m sport. Some of the dash pieces might be from the g20

[jmg]

Originally Posted by Sweeney921

Electronic E-brake says a lot about this car's target customer.

The Z4/Supra aren't rally cars. They have more than enough power to go sideways without an e-brake. What demographic are you referring to?

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by jmg

The Z4/Supra aren't rally cars. They have more than enough power to go sideways without an e-brake. What demographic are you referring to?

People who can't drive stick.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by bimmer456

People who can't drive stick.

I'm talking about the e-brake.

Speaking of stick, I've been driving for over 20 years, mostly stick. I'm happy with the DCT and unless I get a manual M3/4 next, I'll probably never drive another stick again because they just won't exist anymore.

[SportySpice]

Originally Posted by upsidedownfunnel

Toyota makes cars with interiors FAR better than what we have in our F30s in Japan and through their Lexus brand. And better than what will be in the G20.

Not to thread jack, but I spent a fair bit of time in my sister's 2017 Lexus ES350 or whatever it is over the holidays. I didn't find the interior to be "FAR better" than my 2015 335i. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by SportySpice

Not to thread jack, but I spent a fair bit of time in my sister's 2017 Lexus ES350 or whatever it is over the holidays. I didn't find the interior to be "FAR better" than my 2015 335i. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

The ES competes with the 5 series which is more refined than the F30 which is a sports sedan that the Lexus IS competes with. The ES underpinnings are from the Avalon.

[luckstr]

Originally Posted by Gen13 F36

Seriously...everything on this Supra look like a BMW catalog. I just want to know how will the Toyota Supra purist will take say about this car.😂

What really makes me laugh is when I read " Toyota has brought back the Supra". No, they brought back some car that they called a Supra, but has nothing in common at all with the Supra of old. All Toyota did was take a BMW and put a Supra badge on it. Too bad, I was really excited about the "new" Supra before I found out it was nothing like a Supra.

[SportySpice]

Originally Posted by bimmer456

The ES competes with the 5 series which is more refined than the F30 which is a sports sedan that the Lexus IS competes with. The ES underpinnings are from the Avalon.

Size-wise perhaps the ES competes with the 5. Price-wise, the ES is in the 3 series ballpark. I'm not saying that they serve the same target consumers - my point was just that I didn't find the Toyota / Lexus interior FAR above what's in a BMW F30, as someone else claimed.

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by SportySpice

Size-wise perhaps the ES competes with the 5. Price-wise, the ES is in the 3 series ballpark. I'm not saying that they serve the same target consumers - my point was just that I didn't find the Toyota / Lexus interior FAR above what's in a BMW F30, as someone else claimed.

Oh I see you thought the opposite that it wasn't far better.

[idontsave]

So...

who's gonna be the first one to slap a BMW badge on it?

[upsidedownfunnel]

Originally Posted by SportySpice

Not to thread jack, but I spent a fair bit of time in my sister's 2017 Lexus ES350 or whatever it is over the holidays. I didn't find the interior to be "FAR better" than my 2015 335i. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

The ES is a bit of Toyota Lexus hybrid. It is based on the Camry (and now Avalon) so is a FWD econobox with luxury bits.

The real luxury cars are the IS, GS, and LS (3, 5, 7 competitors).

[NormanConquest]

And a good interior layout, everything pretty initiative so why break what already works

[Elvisfan]

Originally Posted by trilltx

I honestly hate everything about this vehicle. Price, aesthetics, performance, nothing about this car warrants a $50K+ price tag.

Fortunately you won’t be required to buy it.

[MT4life]

Originally Posted by bimmer456

People who can't drive stick.

Read somewhere they might bring 6MT, hoping it's true

[Sweeney921]

Originally Posted by jmg

The Z4/Supra aren't rally cars. They have more than enough power to go sideways without an e-brake. What demographic are you referring to?

The demographic that only uses the E-brake to park on an incline. BMWs/Supras are supposed to be driver's cars, so I'm disappointed to see them cater to customers that don't know how to, or want to use the E-brake as a driver's "tool."

Electronic E-brakes are just another control taken away from the driver, albeit a much more minor one than, say, manual transmissions.

[idontsave]

Originally Posted by Sweeney921

The demographic that only uses the E-brake to park on an incline. BMWs/Supras are supposed to be driver's cars, so I'm disappointed to see them cater to customers that don't know how to, or want to use the E-brake as a driver's "tool."

Electronic E-brakes are just another control taken away from the driver, albeit a much more minor one than, say, manual transmissions.

Something about electronic E-brakes just feels awkward to me, but it's only a matter of time now before they're in every car

[5mall5nail5]

Originally Posted by Sweeney921

The demographic that only uses the E-brake to park on an incline. BMWs/Supras are supposed to be driver's cars, so I'm disappointed to see them cater to customers that don't know how to, or want to use the E-brake as a driver's "tool."

Electronic E-brakes are just another control taken away from the driver, albeit a much more minor one than, say, manual transmissions.

Been driving manual trans, LSD, race suspension, high horsepower BMWs for about 16 years and have not once pulled my ebrake for any sort of "tool" while performance driving.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by Sweeney921

The demographic that only uses the E-brake to park on an incline. BMWs/Supras are supposed to be driver's cars, so I'm disappointed to see them cater to customers that don't know how to, or want to use the E-brake as a driver's "tool."

Electronic E-brakes are just another control taken away from the driver, albeit a much more minor one than, say, manual transmissions.

You can slide without an e-brake on a RWD 300+ hp 50/50 3300lb coupe and there are better cars for some offroad rally racing. For what it is, the lack of an e-brake isn't that big of a deal. Manuals are going away, so we might as well get used to it.

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by MT4life

Read somewhere they might bring 6MT, hoping it's true

The tuner crowd will figure out how to get a 6 MT from a doner BMW into this car no problem. Reminds me of the civics and intergras back in the day that went from AT to MT in many garages throughout the country.

[Wires]

I honestly just don't get this car. It's not really a "collaboration". It's a Z4 with Toyota sheet metal wrapping it. 90% of the parts will be stamped BMW. Toyota did that joint collaboration with Subaru (they had the Scion FRS, Subaru the BRZ) which was similar, but my understanding in that case it was a co-designed vehicle.

Only thing I can think of is Toyota feels their brand needs a more performance vehicle, and BMW wants greater penetration into the Asian/import market.

It reminds me when Dodge announced the "Neon" back in the 90's. You could get a Dodge Neon, Plymouth Neon, Chrysler Neon (and they all looked almost identical).

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by Wires

I honestly just don't get this car. It's not really a "collaboration". It's a Z4 with Toyota sheet metal wrapping it. 90% of the parts will be stamped BMW. Toyota did that joint collaboration with Subaru (they had the Scion FRS, Subaru the BRZ) which was similar, but my understanding in that case it was a co-designed vehicle.

Only thing I can think of is Toyota feels their brand needs a more performance vehicle, and BMW wants greater penetration into the Asian/import market.

It reminds me when Dodge announced the "Neon" back in the 90's. You could get a Dodge Neon, Plymouth Neon, Chrysler Neon (and they all looked almost identical).

The subaru impreza crosstrek is basically a toyota corrola with higher ride height and AWD, maybe slightly longer wheelbase and a hatch. The keyfob has the Subaru badge in place of the toyota badge and a CVT from a prius. The boxer engine is basically a corolla engine split in half and laid sideways on each side to get that lower center of gravity.

[FastF30]

Originally Posted by SportySpice

Size-wise perhaps the ES competes with the 5. Price-wise, the ES is in the 3 series ballpark. I'm not saying that they serve the same target consumers - my point was just that I didn't find the Toyota / Lexus interior FAR above what's in a BMW F30, as someone else claimed.

I find BMW interiors to be just that... BMW.... it's simple and elegant in my eyes... undated which is the biggest thing to me... honestly the new G20 doesn't look much different to me in the sense of following BMW design lines ... Just my opinion... All that sit in my car love it (eye of the beholder)... I think Bimmer owners have been just looking at it too long that's all... The Mercedes looks dated and over done... the ES looks like they are trying to copy bmw more than anything to me anyways... I personally don't care for it... in the end I'm very happy with my interior... as for the supra.... very sad this wasn't japanese engineering.... that was supposed to be the claim to fame return... now it's just like another division of bwm... like Chrysler to Dodge, Buick to Chevy etc... sharing same platforms... Companys are budding up more than ever... Ford is getting in bed with VW.... What's next... Porsche motored Mustang???? (P.s. 2022 mustang is rumored AWD... could this be of Audi design???)