[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Who posts on the web about ramps AFTER they fail?

Just sayin'

Lol, very true. Though E30s are pretty light. Enough adrenaline, you might be able.tomlift.itnoff you if you work out :P

My porky X5 or TBSS... No so much.

[omasou]

I've placed my E36M3 on four jack stands but it is kinda sketch and I wouldn't recommend it.

The only reason to do it is to change the exhaust, etc.

If you only plan to change tires, then use the side jack points and do one at a time. I would never put the car or 4 jack stands just to change tires.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by omasou

I've placed my E36M3 on four jack stands but it is kinda sketch and I wouldn't recommend it.

The only reason to do it is to change the exhaust, etc.

If you only plan to change tires, then use the side jack points and do one at a time. I would never put the car or 4 jack stands just to change tires.

It shouldn't be sketchy at all. I put my TBSS on 4 stands and its way bigger then an E36. It was rock solid on there.

I swapped the motor in a 996 on Jack stands. To be fair, we also had a forklift we used to lift the body of the car and the engine came out the bottom. That was sketchy. We found out afterwards the Jack stands were the ones from.harbor freight that could collapse. My dad had bought them specifically for this job, so he got to return them for a full refund, lol.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Who posts on the web about ramps AFTER they fail?

Just sayin'

A composite failure isn't a catastrophic event like a hydraulic pump failure, and since they are used in PAIRS you're probably looking at a non-lethal event, which would be on every car forum in the world within 2 days.

[tranquility]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

A composite failure isn't a catastrophic event like a hydraulic pump failure, and since they are used in PAIRS you're looking at a non-lethal lethal event, which would be on every car forum in the world within 2 days.

He died 2 days after posting.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by omasou

I've placed my E36M3 on four jack stands but it is kinda sketch and I wouldn't recommend it.

The only reason to do it is to change the exhaust, etc.

If you only plan to change tires, then use the side jack points and do one at a time. I would never put the car or 4 jack stands just to change tires.

Seriously, why?

Why is everyone so scared of jackstands?

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

A composite failure isn't a catastrophic event like a hydraulic pump failure, and since they are used in PAIRS you're probably looking at a non-lethal event, which would be on every car forum in the world within 2 days.

Depends on which side of the car you are under...

[tranquility]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Seriously, why?

Why is everyone so scared of jackstands?

I'm confused too, isn't it the standard/safest way to hoist up a car at home?

[omasou]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Seriously, why?

Why is everyone so scared of jackstands?

I have absolutely NO problem with jack stands and probably own more than most.

The problem comes in putting a car up and then down on 4 jack stands. It's a serious balancing act.

The E36M3 had plenty of ground clearance and putting it up wasn't bad but you do need to exercise caution and care.

1. All jacked car goes up and down at angle, so you have to really make sure the jack stands are positioned correctly and adjust as necessary.

2. Most jacks (that folks buy) have ~17.5" of lift, which may or may not be enough to raise the car above the jack stands. You may get the car on them but you need to make sure you can get the car off.

3. If you f**up, the car is going to come crashing down and it won't be pretty.

I did this before there were QuickJacks and if they were available, I wasn't aware of them. For $2000-$2500, I would buy a QuickJack or 4 post over a good jack and jack stands but of course will still have both. Actually, my two jacks and jack stands cost more than the QuickJack, so not being cheap or scared of them. They are super high quality and can certainly do the job.

That leaves us with why would you want or need to put the car up on 4 jack stands. To change the tires, to rotate the tires, to change the brakes and rotors? Nah, not worth effort, time and more importantly the chance of things going sideways are too great and too expensive.

Lastly, my M2C is too low and requires too much work to lift on all 4s. My X6 is way too f***n heavy and my M235iX is too low and doesn't have an easily accessible front lift point.

But hey can you do it, yeah. The real question is why would you.

PS. Re the ramp comment. I have ramps too. Will I drive up them? Hell no. Will I put the front tires under them instead of jack stands, yes. If you lift the car onto ramps you know they will not come off and are more secure when lifting the rear.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by omasou

I have absolutely NO problem with jack stands and probably own more than most.

The problem comes in putting a car up and then down on 4 jack stands. It's a serious balancing act.

The E36M3 had plenty of ground clearance and putting it up wasn't bad but you do need to exercise caution and care.

1. All jacked car goes up and down at angle, so you have to really make sure the jack stands are positioned correctly and adjust as necessary.

2. Most jacks (that folks buy) have ~17.5" of lift, which may or may not be enough to raise the car above the jack stands. You may get the car on them but you need to make sure you can get the car off.

3. If you f**up, the car is going to come crashing down and it won't be pretty.

I did this before there were QuickJacks and if they were available, I wasn't aware of them. For $2000-$2500, I would buy a QuickJack or 4 post over a good jack and jack stands but of course will still have both. Actually, my two jacks and jack stands cost more than the QuickJack, so not being cheap or scared of them. They are super high quality and can certainly do the job.

That leaves us with why would you want or need to put the car up on 4 jack stands. To change the tires, to rotate the tires, to change the brakes and rotors? Nah, not worth effort, time and more importantly the chance of things going sideways are too great and too expensive.

Lastly, my M2C is too low and requires too much work to lift on all 4s. My X6 is way too f***n heavy and my M235iX is too low and doesn't have an easily accessible front lift point.

But hey can you do it, yeah. The real question is why would you.

PS. Re the ramp comment. I have ramps too. Will I drive up them? Hell no. Will I put the front tires under them instead of jack stands, yes. If you lift the car onto ramps you know they will not come off and are more secure when lifting the rear.

On a modern BMW with no spare, how do you rotate tires with just one corner off the ground at a time?

Bleed brakes? Jack the car up 4 times? What a PITA.

4-post lifts are great for storage...

[omasou]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

On a modern BMW with no spare, how do you rotate tires with just one corner off the ground at a time?

Bleed brakes? Jack the car up 4 times? What a PITA.

4-post lifts are great for storage...

If you use the side jack point front or back it will lift both wheels off the ground and you can put a jack stand under the other point and you can swap front to back. But I don't rotate tires, I burn them up and buy new ones.

Brake bleeding is a good example of lifting the car. Again, not saying people shouldn't do it but instead that some people don't have the skill/experience, proper tools and they are not anal enough to pay the proper amount of ATTENTION to do it. I would only recommend doing it on the flat concrete in the garage.

4 posts have an option for adding one or two jacks. Not cheap but, I would rather own a 4 post over a 2 post.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by omasou

If you use the side jack point front or back it will lift both wheels off the ground and you can put a jack stand under the other point and you can swap front to back. But I don't rotate tires, I burn them up and buy new ones.

Brake bleeding is a good example of lifting the car. Again, not saying people shouldn't do it but instead that some people don't have the skill/experience, proper tools and they are not anal enough to pay the proper amount of ATTENTION to do it. I would only recommend doing it on the flat concrete in the garage.

4 posts have an option for adding one or two jacks. Not cheap but, I would rather own a 4 post over a 2 post.

But you still have the jack issue with the 4-post. And the rails and apparatus are in the way. Lifting at one lift point means one corner is supported by a hydraulic jack, which is not safe.

[omasou]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

But you still have the jack issue with the 4-post. And the rails and apparatus are in the way. Lifting at one lift point means one corner is supported by a hydraulic jack, which is not safe.

If you use the side jack point front or back it will lift both wheels off the ground and you can put a jack stand under the other point and you can swap front to back.

https://www.bendpak.com/car-lifts/4-post-bridge-jacks/

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by omasou

If you use the side jack point front or back it will lift both wheels off the ground and you can put a jack stand under the other point and you can swap front to back.

https://www.bendpak.com/car-lifts/4-post-bridge-jacks/

So, with a 4 post you have to add on a $2,100 accessory that lifts just 2 wheels off the lift rails at a time, or move the feet inboard of the lifting blocks (on German cars) and then lift half the car at a time, then eventually sit the vehicle down on 4 jackstands (another $300 for a set of 4 Esco stands) and still worry about the welds breaking.

I can have my car raised to working height in 45 seconds with zero obstructions to do any type of maintenance work. From brake bleeding, to transmission removal, to exhaust work, to an oil pan gasket replacement (with subframe drop), all free and clear of the lift mechanism. And I can minutely change the height of the vehicle to get perfect access to nearly any fastener I need to remove without any obstruction.

And I can store two vehicles in the same space just like a 4-post lift.

4-posts just have too many limitations.

[omasou]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

So, with a 4 post you have to add on a $2,100 accessory that lifts just 2 wheels off the lift rails at a time, or move the feet inboard of the lifting blocks (on German cars) and then lift half the car at a time, then eventually sit the vehicle down on 4 jackstands (another $300 for a set of 4 Esco stands) and still worry about the welds breaking.

I can have my car raised to working height in 45 seconds with zero obstructions to do any type of maintenance work. From brake bleeding, to transmission removal, to exhaust work, to an oil pan gasket replacement (with subframe drop), all free and clear of the lift mechanism. And I can minutely change the height of the vehicle to get perfect access to nearly any fastener I need to remove without any obstruction.

And I can store two vehicles in the same space just like a 4-post lift.

4-posts just have too many limitations.

Anyone working on their car will have a jack and 4 jack stand so that is a sunk cost.

The next option is what is the best choice for lifting a car off the ground. From least expensive to most.

0. Jack and jack stands - danger dropping the car

1. QuickJack - relatively inexpensive and safe. May need to spend more for larger unit if lifting SUVs.

2. Scissor lift. disadvantage cannot walk under car

3. 2 post, disadvantage, most likely will have to cut garage floor to reinforce concrete, difficult to enter and exit car while on lift (posts in the way), post connect either top or bottom. Bottom problem for lowered cars, top problem for lift height. If car is not leveled or if you remove major weight, car can fall off.

4. 4 post, advantages, does not have to be bolted to garage floor, can store 2 cars in the same space. disadvantages, to remove wheels requires bridge jack and maybe jack stands.

I never said you cannot lift a car using a jack and stands. I said it is a PITA and dangerous and the real possibility of dropping your car. I also call BS on lifting the car in 45 seconds. You are also over simplifying the process and downplaying the negatives for anyone coming across your post.

For the OP, I would recommend 4 low profile ESCO jack stands w/flat tops and a AC Hydraulic DK20Q 4400lb Floor Jack with QuickLift Pedal. Yes, these are expensive but saving you money in the long run. Best price + free shipping for ESCO, https://www.homedepot.com/p/ESCO-3-T...PAIR/326913101 if prior military subtract another 10%.

If your garage (flat surface) is small then be careful lifting on the driveway. B/c of the slope the driveway is enough that it will not be level either left to right or front to back and makes the process even more challenging.

You can search the internet for a less expensive jacks but it will most likely have less than 19" lift height. Quick search looks like Schwaben has some for a bit less.

If you research lifts they are not inexpensive and you get what you pay for. Also the prices listed are MSRP not the actual price.

Good luck. Don't drop your car.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by omasou

2. Most jacks (that folks buy) have ~17.5" of lift, which may or may not be enough to raise the car above the jack stands. You may get the car on them but you need to make sure you can get the car off.

These goobers need to get smarter and buy these.
https://www.harborfreight.com/3-ton-long-reach-low-profile-professional-floor-jack-with-rapid-pump-blue-56641.html

They're inexpensive, well built, and lift to over 24". They slide under lowered Corvettes with ease so nothing BMW makes would pose an issue unless you have truly slammed the crap out of the car.

[omasou]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Lol. Don't drop my car. Funny.

So, please don't try to insult me about lifting my car; trust me, I know more about car lifts and lifting cars safely than you or most people here.

So unlike most people w/residential garages you have a purpose built work area but yet nonchalantly post how lifting a car onto 4 jack stands is simple and without consequence or warning, if done wrong.

Nice.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by omasou

So unlike most people w/residential garages you have a purpose built work area but yet nonchalantly post how lifting a car onto 4 jack stands is simple and without consequence or warning, if done wrong.

Nice.

If you have a residential garage to work in, that's a bigger drive to using a jack and stands! I'd love a lift, but I have no hope of fitting one. Quickjack type stuff I could fit, but a real lift I' be fighting the garage door overhear, and the low ceiling. If you have a residential garage that's not purposely designed for working on cars, jack and stands all the way.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

If you have a residential garage to work in, that's a bigger drive to using a jack and stands! I'd love a lift, but I have no hope of fitting one. Quickjack type stuff I could fit, but a real lift I' be fighting the garage door overhear, and the low ceiling. If you have a residential garage that's not purposely designed for working on cars, jack and stands all the way.

This ^

[bosstones]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Seriously, why?

Why is everyone so scared of jackstands?

It's an election year. People get jittery.

[billnchristy]

I bought these from ETA MFG, a little pricey but lifts my mustang to around 28" from the bottom of the body and since they are under the tires the car is completely open on the bottom.

You use the front and rear lift points to get the four stands under the tires and then lift each individually until the locks engage.

To lower you lift a bit above the locks to release them and then lower to the lower position, then remove them in sets.

https://www.etamfg.com/shop.html?sto...ece-p251344787

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by billnchristy

I bought these from ETA MFG, a little pricey but lifts my mustang to around 28" from the bottom of the body and since they are under the tires the car is completely open on the bottom.

You use the front and rear lift points to get the four stands under the tires and then lift each individually until the locks engage.

To lower you lift a bit above the locks to release them and then lower to the lower position, then remove them in sets.

https://www.etamfg.com/shop.html?sto...ece-p251344787

So once the tires are on the stands, you then place the floor jack under the tire tray and lift each corner?