[X5MnM3comp]

The question about whether bmw will “eat” the cost rather than passing on to consumers, the short answer is no. BMW is a business to make money, not a charity. However will they consider to absorb portion of it to keep their prices competitive? Maybe. All depends on their min profit margin threshold. But from a strategic perspective, i think it’s unlikely the exemption would apply to M cars since it’s a skewed market for people that are above average wealth. If they decide to, the exemptions or reduced price increase will most likely be applied to none M models that are most sold and mass produced by bmw. Truth is bmw does not depend on selling M cars to keep their lights on. And as I mentioned earlier, people buy M cars regularly will continue to do so. Just think have you ever walked into any dealership and saw 20 M cars in the lot not sold? Most of times, there’s none and if there is, there’s a sold tag on the windshield. There are more rich people out there than you think. What would be a detriment to bmw is not able to capture the mass majority demand on intro level more affordable models where volume of sale is the king of the supply chain principle. So as much as I’d want to be hopeful as everyone else do, if you’re buying an M car, be ready to pay more or buy domestic vehicles like Cadillac ct4 Blackwing or corvette or something. And don’t expect to get away from buying used M. If I decide to sell my 25’ m3cx in 6 mos when the %increase is defined on new units, you’d bet that I would also mark up the same % so will every other sellers.

[kudos]

Would be great if the MX factory moves to the USA. At least when it comes to the 2 series there have been some quality control issues (headlights for example).

[X5MnM3comp]

Originally Posted by kudos

Would be great if the MX factory moves to the USA. At least when it comes to the 2 series there have been some quality control issues (headlights for example).

If that’s the case you’d be looking at paying probably 30-40% more because of the higher inflation, labor, real estate , utilities, all overhead costs.

[afadeev]

Originally Posted by DrVenture

That would be ironic if this caused diehard ICE buyers to flee for EVs, lol. If you want AWD and high HP in a sedan, the options do seem to be German and EVs though.

I would add Corvettes, and E-Ray (hybrid) to the list of potential "substitutes" at an "affordable" price point.

Originally Posted by X5MnM3comp

If that’s the case you’d be looking at paying probably 30-40% more because of the higher inflation, labor, real estate , utilities, all overhead costs.

Yep, and the quality will take a further dip.
Everyone I know who has had an X-car has had problems and ditched them.

I would NOT be interested in buying German cars NOT manufactured in Germany. Especially not ///M-cars.

a

[X5MnM3comp]

Originally Posted by 440i6MT

Undocumented can legally collect aid. This new change in California social services policy is one of the reason I chose to leave the public sector earlier this year.
Despicable breaking of the social contract by our government.

Ok I do not support that, it not right for the taxpayers. Going through naturalization process and become a law binding citizen, work and pay taxes is a must if the opportunity is possible for those I mentioned. But if you ask me whom I think deserves to live here between the hard working undocumented and jobless ruthless rioters that beat up cops, I think for public safety get rid of all of the criminals if that’s what we’re doing to provide safe environment for the public.

[X5MnM3comp]

Originally Posted by mvigod

Polls so far I've taken asking about tariffs across brands:

Porsche Cayman Poll (not across the entire brand): 61% would cancel. 39% would keep order

Ferrari (entire brand lineup): 80% would cancel. 20% would keep order

BMW(entire brand lineup): 79% would cancel. 21% would keep order

It is interesting how close Ferrari and BMW were in this poll among those who ordered vehicles with both sitting at about 80% cancellation. Porsche (I polled Cayman buyers only, not the full brand lineup) sits at 61%. I have to run a full brand poll on Porsche to see if it changes. I suspect it probably will rise closer to 80% once it includes their SUV's

Either way, this tells me that if tariffs are placed on the EU, the auto market & everything connected to them in the EU and the USA will suffer a great deal.

If the tariff drops below 25% I'd imagine the 80% would decrease along every 5% reduction as price elasticity would change. By the same token, I would expect it to rise higher if the tariff extended beyond 25%.

Great study on this across the brand. However the sample in this statistical analysis is extremely isolated that can only represent a fraction of those car buyers. Majority of high end car owners buy and own multiple high end cars are probably not on here. They also probably just buy whatever they see in the showroom. Even if they custom order, and we take those sample pool into consideration, it will bump up the “yes keep the order “ significantly surpasses the other survey answers. Many car enthusiasts on here because of their passion for cars, not necessarily owning a high end car is like owning a 60” smart tv at home.

Much appreciated in spending time to conduct this survey. But I wouldn’t use these skewed results to predict how the market will respond nor what manufacturers would do.

[Mavus]

Originally Posted by DrVenture

What you are saying may apply to individual items/parts shipped here for assembly. But, a finished vehicle from a country subject to tariffs will be assessed the full amount. Whether or not any business chooses to absorb the added cost is yet to be seen. Let's be clear, if BMW "eats" it, that means their investors eat it. Lost profits have repercussions.

In 2023 the U.S. imported almost $600 billion in goods from the EU. The point is to make it hurt, not for it to make no difference. Consumers are losers in trade wars.

well USMCA agreement is still in effect as far as I know and it will be interesting to find out if US decides to pull out or not but there are rules specified for auto industry tariffs

[Efthreeoh]

I cut my own yard. 5 acres.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by BMWCCA1

I understand sarcasm, but that's a pretty bold statement to post here among many who still think only no SUV can ever be considered a real BMW.

Well, , it's the truth. Have you seen their latest sedans? They're largely crap. The best sedan they have right now is the 8 GC,, and it's barely a sedan. X5 and X7 are the best products that BMW has right now, by a HUGE margin.

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by mvigod

Polls so far I've taken asking about tariffs across brands:

Porsche Cayman Poll (not across the entire brand): 61% would cancel. 39% would keep order

Ferrari (entire brand lineup): 80% would cancel. 20% would keep order

BMW(entire brand lineup): 79% would cancel. 21% would keep order

It is interesting how close Ferrari and BMW were in this poll among those who ordered vehicles with both sitting at about 80% cancellation. Porsche (I polled Cayman buyers only, not the full brand lineup) sits at 61%. I have to run a full brand poll on Porsche to see if it changes. I suspect it probably will rise closer to 80% once it includes their SUV's

Either way, this tells me that if tariffs are placed on the EU, the auto market & everything connected to them in the EU and the USA will suffer a great deal.

If the tariff drops below 25% I'd imagine the 80% would decrease along every 5% reduction as price elasticity would change. By the same token, I would expect it to rise higher if the tariff extended beyond 25%.

The idea that FERRARI buyers are worried about a tariff to the point that they're gonna cancel their order tells me your poll has zero value. The idea that guys who are waiting years for the opportunity to buy a Ferrari are gonna walk away because of a new price hike is laughable. I guess the triple years worth of other buyers will be happy though.

Again, this all goes away if the EU doesn't levy higher tariffs on US imports than the US levoed on them. It should be a warning that if you want to do business with the most powerful economy in the world, you have to play nice and don't try to screw us.

[X5MnM3comp]

So here’s my summary

Known facts as of today: 25% tariff on Canada and Mexico executed today. 10% in addition to prior 25% on China executed. Tariff on EU, trump clearly stated will happen in near future

Unknown: tariff on EU, how much and when.

Veblen Good. Please look up this terminology to describe a specific economic condition. It will be helpful.

BMW makes M cars to satisfy those car enthusiasts and those just want the most expensive car models, just because. But know that % of revenue is no where near to be considered their primary source of revenue. The real bread and butter comes from large volume of economical models that can be afforded by vast majority consumers. Just look up what are their highest sales model cars. So I personally think if the tariff becomes reality car manufacturers will focus on subsidizing their economical models over high end ones to sustain their profitability. Don’t expect the M models price ro remain or come down. Instead they will rise. The limited production in normal circumstances is already in short compared to demand. BMW will rather see this as an advantage to increase price to offset the reduction in profit margin on economic models in order to stay competitive. Again Veblen Good.

[X5MnM3comp]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

The idea that FERRARI buyers are worried about a tariff to the point that they're gonna cancel their order tells me your poll has zero value. The idea that guys who are waiting years for the opportunity to buy a Ferrari are gonna walk away because of a new price hike is laughable. I guess the triple years worth of other buyers will be happy though.

Again, this all goes away if the EU doesn't levy higher tariffs on US imports than the US levoed on them. It should be a warning that if you want to do business with the most powerful economy in the world, you have to play nice and don't try to screw us.

Don’t disagree on your comment about the survey result.

US is in no position to declare trade wars today if the government cares about its people. Just look at the interest rate, the high inflation. How many people are on the streets old and young. How many more are being added on daily basis. Not to mention government financial deficiencies as trump openly admits. Little history background, US became the wealthiest country from being the biggest trader in the world before. And today we are doing just the opposite. But timing of doing this will risk of driving even more people that are hanging for survival onto the streets because nothing will be affordable. And this forum will reduce in its population because less people will be able to own M cars. Those can possibly be you and myself. Also what if every country retaliates, our farmers will suffer as well. Yes the increase in tariffs does bring money in to pay off some debts government owes, but realize that money ultimately comes from your pocket. So are ok with payong high price goods on almost everything with limited choice, paying high rates of taxes every year while being afraid of people robbing you or your house because of the shortage in law enforcement forces, driving your M car on shitty roads constantly worry about running into potholes and wondering where your tax dollars were spent on? If the government really cares about their people, not the 1% 2% , the vast majority and keeps the economy running, let consumers enjoy variety of goods at inexpensive prices, put money back in their pockets. There are plenty of things to reduce bs spending. How about take a look at legal citizens that don’t contribute for shit but take advantage of government aid programs to cheat taxpayers contributions. How about not trying to be the world leader all the time spend crap loads of money that doesn’t benefit our own people? How about just negotiate in a civil manner? Making threats that won’t benefit anyone on the expense of own people is just childish