[supra93]

Towards the end she mentions that Europe will be limited to 130 units a month / 1,560 units annually.

[yco]

Originally Posted by supra93

Towards the end she mentions that Europe will be limited to 130 units a month / 1,560 units annually.

i guess its for 2020 pre-order..
900 units for 2019 with A90 Euro only version..

https://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-ne...-ar184253.html ..

[WestRace]

Originally Posted by supra93

Towards the end she mentions that Europe will be limited to 130 units a month / 1,560 units annually.

The last time I trusted a blond it costs me 5 years and counting. Pure evil.

[Humdizzle]

Originally Posted by R N M

LOL - not sure what you are talking about.

BRZ has amazing steering - direct, quick, consistent and just heavy enough.
I have owned BRZ since 2015 and also have 2018 M3 Comp - BRZ has by far the better steering and closest to what the BMW hydraulic setups were just not as heavy.
The interior of the BRZ is great as well - seating position, seats, steering wheel, shifter, leg room, and visibility. There are ZERO sports cars that can match it.

Handling is incredible- it stays flat in turns and at high speeds, there is no lift.
With stock tires - its not setup for max grip, put a decent set and your laptimes will dramatically improve!
Miata is MUCH smaller inside, i personally cant have a normal seating position and im 5‘11. its also more softly sprung and has very loose steering. I‘m not a fan of it.

Agreed. I've had alot of nice sports cars. From a e36 m3 to a GTR to a 458. The brz/86 is grossly under rated for how good it is. It's steering feel is way better than my f80. It's a much more connected experience. Quality > quantity when it comes to performance

Even the engineering explained guy drove the supra and 86 back to back and said the 86 was more fun

[Red Bread]

Using modern BMW ZF EPS feel as a benchmark is sort of like using Cadillac's median buyer age to talk about how woke your buyers are. I stand by BRZ steering feel sucking. Extensive road and track time with them does not impress me.

The rumor has been that Subaru had a decent setup in place to take advantage of the low center of gravity and rearward engine placement and then Toyota's dual mode injection and some other engineering snafus forced the motor to be mounted further forward than intended, causing the steering rack to move forward and the steering arms to be in the front, rather than the rear of the front calipers, the ideal setup.

Reviews of the current WRX and STI have commented how they have better steering feel than the BRZ. That's just sad. I of course haven't driven the Zupra, and realize it will have BMW's take on ZF EPS, but I'd hope it has better steering than the GT86.

[TXSTYLE]

Toyota under rating it's true POWER???

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...d-test-review/

[M Coupe]

Originally Posted by TXSTYLE

Toyota under rating it's true POWER???

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...d-test-review/

Yes!

Now why does your username sound familiar to me? Houston-Imports?

[TXSTYLE]

Originally Posted by M Coupe

Yes!

Now why does your username sound familiar to me? Houston-Imports?

Nah. I'm up north in the Dallas area.

[supra93]

The Video is in German, but with English subtitles.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Using modern BMW ZF EPS feel as a benchmark is sort of like using Cadillac's median buyer age to talk about how woke your buyers are. I stand by BRZ steering feel sucking. Extensive road and track time with them does not impress me.

It's only funny because it's true.

I let my friend drive my MZ4 Coupe once. He's been extolling the virtues of his F30 328i and how sharp and precise the steering is.

Then he proceeds to go wide eyed and "holy sh*t omg" all the way down the twisty mountain road. Every single turn. "Holy sh*t. OMG. Holy sh*t. OMG."

You don't know what you don't know until you know. My other toy has been virtually universally praised for its implementation of electric power steering assist. To a man, the journos all praise the C7 Corvette as having a fantastic steering feel and amazingly responsive front end.

To that, the MZ4 Coupe says "b*tch hold my beer" every time I hop back in. Again, the C7 Corvette does have a fantastic front end grip and excellent feedback, for an electrically assisted steering.

But hold a candle to the mighty Servotronic hydraulic steering from the late 90s and early 80s it can not. IT. CAN. NOT. You don't know what real steering feel FEELS like unless you've driven an E36 M3 or variants using it's steering rack design (Z3 M, Z4 M). Heck I'd even trade the Corvette's vaunted "steering feel" for something resembling the steering from my E46 323Ci.

[Humdizzle]

You don't know what real steering feel is until you drive a car without power steering. At least that's what my friend with an RX7 and other miata bros tell me.

I agree my e36 M3 steering feel was amazing. I remember when i sold that and got my e46 m3 and felt a little let down with the feel, but i soon got over it since it had the s54.

[angelr]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

You don't know what real steering feel is until you drive a car without power steering. At least that's what my friend with an RX7 and other miata bros tell me.

I agree my e36 M3 steering feel was amazing. I remember when i sold that and got my e46 m3 and felt a little let down with the feel, but i soon got over it since it had the s54.

Miatas are good but my fave was the first gen MR2, it had great steering feel and response. I had an 85 in high school that I loved.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

You don't know what real steering feel is until you drive a car without power steering. At least that's what my friend with an RX7 and other miata bros tell me.

That is ALSO true. I drove an unassisted 91 NSX on track once. Holy sh*t OMG. Once up to speed, you forget how hard it was to maneuver the car out of its parking spot, and you soon realize that if you can EVER be sexually attracted to how a steering SHOULD feel, this was it.

It was about as close to having bareback sex as compared to steering feel as it gets.

In my entire 20 or so years of driving a wide variety of cars on track, only 2 cars have ever come remotely close of getting me "excited." The 91, no power steering NSX, and a late model Lotus Exige 240S. Those two car's steering makes you question your desire for the opposite sex, a little.

Not enough to make me want to give it up for sure.

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by angelr

Miatas are good but my fave was the first gen MR2, it had great steering feel and response. I had an 85 in high school that I loved.

Those were great. Too bad I didn't fit in them. My CRX Si with manual steering was still fun, until it was pointing the wrong way. That seemed to happen a lot.

[supra93]

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by The HACK

and a late model Lotus Exige 240S.

Those were just the glue fumes. But seriously, those did have nice steering. The NSX is probably the heaviest thing I've driven with manual steering. With sticky tires, that was a workout to parallel park.

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Those were just the glue fumes. But seriously, those did have nice steering. The NSX is probably the heaviest thing I've driven with manual steering. With sticky tires, that was a workout to parallel park.

The one I drove, they told me NOT to shut it off when I park it because the car wouldn't start again.

There were 3 Lotus Exige 240S there that day. Out of the 3, only 2 runs. Out of the 2 that runs, one had a fuel leak in the engine bay that ultimately they had to shut down and take out of rotation, and the other one...Well, was what I drove that can't be turned off, otherwise they can't restart it again.

It was funny that they had a fire extinguisher standing by with the other car, just in case the fuel leak got bad enough that the hot engine would ignite the leaking fuel. At that point, shouldn't you just, um, shut the car down and park it? I just thought the fact that they said, "you can either wait until the other Lotus is back from the other journalist test driving it, or you can take this one, but at any point if you smell fuel, pit in ASAP" was a little suspect.

But man...That steering feel. OMG. Holy sh*t.

[Red Bread]

British cars, not like real cars...

[N0Chill 335i]

https://www.thedrive.com/opinion/280...een-asking-for

"I'd actually go a step further—and likely enrage those same online trolls—by saying that in my eyes, the new Supra is a true successor to BMW’s legendary and truly iconic E30 M3. That sacrosanct sports car is what many submit as evidence of BMW’s lost identity. The formula of two doors, lightweight, and fun as all hell was simple and seemingly unrepeatable. That is, until the Supra. But better yet, the Supra's also over $20,000 cheaper than the E30 M3 was when it was new—when adjusted for inflation, the price for a 1988 M3 today would be $73,000."

[angelr]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

British cars, not like real cars...

Lol, I had a 73 MG Midget in high school (gorgeous sky blue over black with some lovely knock off wheels in amazing shape) while I worked at a place called British American motors and this is very true. I pushed that Mg almost as much as I drove it and every cent I "made" working at this British sports car shop went back into my MG...until I bought the MR2 and the MG started to languish.

[M Coupe]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

British cars, not like real cars...

An interesting fact with these "British" cars (that tickles me and so I have to share), is that they take OEM Toyota MR2 Turbo Oil Filters!!..which is great b/c I have a lifetime supply of them.

My British Racing Green Exige S below next to my Nautical Blue MR2 Turbo! They make me smile when I stand b/w them.

Also, the "Back on Topic" Gal below is saying to us right now "Shaddup and get a 2020 Supra and I will ride with you"

[SEAT TIME RULES]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

No it isn't. A Miata is. But a GT86 is a hot mess of bad steering, cheap interior and a huge torque dip at 4,500 rpm that Subie and Toyota refuse to address. It also likes to lean itself out under track use because of the Toyota developed dual mode injection.

It should be a great car, but I've extensively driven both versions both before and after LCI and would take an ND Miata over one every time.

I've owned both a 2013 FRS and currently a ND Miata RF.

The steering is very good in the GT86 so I 100% disagree on that one point.

The motor in the Twins sucks! Its TQ dip in the midrange is inexcusable, and the flat four sounds horrible. Also the OEM Rim Tire combo is almost an afterthought.

The car is a hoot to drive but an ND Miata is one of the most balanced exciting cars you can drive at any price. Other than is impracticality there is almost nothing to quibble about. The shifter is the beast I've ever used...