[BayMoWe335]

Originally Posted by Flying Ace

IMO, don't get duped into the clarity "value/premium" discussion.

The 3 most important aspects are size, cut and color. To most people that's what they see, basically how big is the damn rock and does it sparkle. The cut is very important to make it shine, and there are many proprietary ways of making a cut, so the true test here is does that thing shine. Does it pass the basic eye test?

The clarity is regarding "specks" inside the diamond, and you know how you put those magnifying glasses on to look it it? That's what you'll have to do to discern clarity. It's overrated, and your inlaws and boss ain't gonna put some glasses on to inspect it for specks.

If I were to do it again, I would aim high for the best color, and downplay the clarity. My wife's ring is pretty fucking clear, but he color could be better...

So you're buying it to impress others?

Look, I'm not hating on you, but this doesn't make a lot of sense. Just get a cubic zirconia if you want people to think it's awesome.

There is a reason you can get a 2 carat diamond for $10,000 or a 1 carat diamond for $10,000. If they are both $10,000, it means they cost the poor old bloke the same amount. Anyone who knows diamonds know that their call center co-worker with the "big rock" got a shit diamond, regardless of size.

Again, a flawless ideal cut D color 1 carat is about $100,000. To me, that's a much more impressive diamond than a 5 carat yellowish diamond full of inclusions even if you "can't tell."

[KingOfJericho]

My wife and I designed hers together. It's a symbol of OUR relationship and the cost was significant to us to we both had our input.

We opted to spend the money we would have wasted on a wedding on ourselves by splurging on a ring, which lasts forever, and a honeymoon/wedding. We had zero guests and got married on the beach in Kauai. I wouldn't have had it any other way and we are the envy of every person we've met who stressed and stressed over planning their huge party.

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by BayMoWe335

So you're buying it to impress others?

Look, I'm not hating on you, but this doesn't make a lot of sense. Just get a cubic zirconia if you want people to think it's awesome.

There is a reason you can get a 2 carat diamond for $10,000 or a 1 carat diamond for $10,000. If they are both $10,000, it means they cost the poor old bloke the same amount. Anyone who knows diamonds know that their call center co-worker with the "big rock" got a shit diamond, regardless of size.

Again, a flawless ideal cut D color 1 carat is about $100,000. To me, that's a much more impressive diamond than a 5 carat yellowish diamond full of inclusions even if you "can't tell."

Impressive to who? Who would ever know that the stone is flawless? Nobody is buying a piss yellow stone, but you can certainly get a larger stone that would pass ANY naked eye test for much less than a perfect grain of sand.

[Naz24]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

Yes, I'm certain diamonds would be drastically reduced in terms of value. But that doesn't take away from the fact that this comment isn't of much value for the following reasons:

A - if someone who has non-perishable goods, not subject to obsolescence, decides to bring all their inventory to market right away, that will obviously decrease the value people are willing to pay for it as supply will outstrip demand and therefore to sell it, the price goes lower to create demand. So it's not just DeBeers that's holding onto their inventory - others do it as well. It's just smart business.

B - why would someone that supplies a commodity / other good have to sell all their inventory (ie. OPEC, dairy producers, etc) just because they have it? They shouldn't have to - nor should the purchaser be required to buy it. The point of a free market.

My basic point is just that diamonds aren't as rare and valuable as many think. There are plenty of them, and its just another artificial product priced by a group of individuals.

I'm not saying its wrong, because hell if i was DeBeers, i'd do the exact same thing. But again, just that diamonds arent super rare and their pricing is determined mostly by DeBeers and the likes.

The other point is that DeBeers launched a genius marketing campaign to ramp up demand for these "stones". They created "Diamonds are forever" in 1939 and made women lust for these stones.

In the end, they are just stones, so it doesn't matter where the OP buys it (costco, tiffany, etc), they are all the same (obviously subject to the international certified ratings) and anybody who tells you differently is uninformed.

[bruza]

This topic has been the cause of many arguments b/w the GF and I. She wants something on the order of $15k to $20k. I'm not interested in spending that much.

The kicker: We haven't looked at rings in 18 months.

I'm not budging

[Naz24]

Originally Posted by bruza

This topic has been the cause of many arguments b/w the GF and I. She wants something on the order of $15k to $20k. I'm not interested in spending that much.

The kicker: We haven't looked at rings in 18 months.

I'm not budging

Go get a 10k ring at costco (which would cost 15-20k at tiffany) throw it in the tiff box and she will never know

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by BayMoWe335

Ring envy wears off, VERY quickly.

That said, it's a diamond. "Bang for buck" is the dumbest, most overrated aspect of diamond buying. Let me see if I can articulate this.

A diamond is rare. It should be rare. Prices are essentially commoditized. You'll pay a bit of a premium at places like Tiffany, but at the end of the day, it's all in the same ballpark.

I know a lot about diamonds. Cut is the most important thing. I'd rather have a slightly more included less white diamond than a terribly cut VVS1 in an E color.

Again, that said, all aspects are important because the entire purpose of buying a diamond is rarity. If you get a 2 carat K color, SI2 clarity, but "no one can tell" it has inclusions and the color is shit, it's still a shit diamond.

Get the best diamond you can for $20,000 or Whatever you're spending.

There is a reason a 1 carat, VVS1, Ideal Cut, E color diamond is ~$12,000 and a 2 carat, SI2, good cut, J color diamond is $10,000. To me, a bigger diamond is just a show off. If it's a shit stone, who cares?

Let me give you some perspective. A 2 carat, essentially flawless, ideal cut, colorless diamond is around $100,000.

Same size, 10x the price.

Long story short, don't fall for sales guys trying to sell you a bigger rock that is a shit diamond. Diamonds should be essentially colorless, no inclusions, and ideally cut. Anything beyond that, you begin to marginalize the entire concept of a diamond.

If the whole pitch is "you can't tell it sucks," just get a cubic zirconia.

My minimums:

• Ideal cut
• D, E or F color (maybe)
• VVS1 is lowest clarity I'd go
• No less than 1 carat (or what's the point)
• No Florescence
• Excellent symmetry
• No Culet

Best post here.

You can get a 1.5 Carat for 7K or a really nice one for 15K-20K+

The cost is going to come down to the QUALITY of the stone.

The size thing isn't really what should matter.

You also have to look out for diamonds that are treated VS natural and there are SOO many other factors not just clarity and size.

Your minimums are very healthy. You can still get a beautiful diamond for a G color and SI1 but that's the lowest I'd recommend. Just going from a G SI1 to F and VVS2 is going to be a good 3K more on the diamond.

According to a few jewelers I've talked to, H and I colors are the most widely sold but that's because they start moving into the category of "You can barely tell" and the cost goes down pretty healthy. Also getting a diamond with florescence will move the price down and again falls into that same "can barely tell" category.

However, if you compare an E or F color to and H or I there is a good difference.

Size is nice but knowing you spent money on a quality natural piece sits better with me, personally.

To each their own though.

If all you care about is size there are guys selling treated "3 Carat" diamonds on ebay with the band for about $5500... It's dog shit.

Best site to use is James allen. You can really see the difference with their site on what you're paying for.

For those looking, go ahead a compare a E Color VVS2 to any I Color SI2 of the same size carat, you will be very surprised to see how much that quality changes.

Stick to a budget and stick to a quality piece the carat size will fall into place.

OH and for hte record I know tons of engaged girls through friends and family and almost none of them know anything about their diamonds but the carat and color if that. Also plenty of them got hand my downs in the 1 carat or less range too with no complaint. It really shouldn't matter.

So buy the ring that makes you feel good about giving it to someone you care about.

[David70]

Originally Posted by bruza

This topic has been the cause of many arguments b/w the GF and I. She wants something on the order of $15k to $20k. I'm not interested in spending that much.

The kicker: We haven't looked at rings in 18 months.

I'm not budging

As said above, take her to Tiffany's and look at $15k rings and then buy one that looks exactly the same somewhere else.

You are both paying for this ring (once you spend the money and then get married the money is gone), so either you can afford it as a couple, you both need to figure out how you can pay for it, or you need to come to some type of compromise. If you can't come to some type of agreement on this type of expenditure you are in for a long line of financial arguments as this is only the beginning.

There are all kinds of things that I want but my wife and I compromise on what is realistic to spend.

[F87LUV]

Originally Posted by bruza

This topic has been the cause of many arguments b/w the GF and I. She wants something on the order of $15k to $20k. I'm not interested in spending that much.

The kicker: We haven't looked at rings in 18 months.

I'm not budging

It shouldn't be an argument. It's your money. What the hell? Idk how some women get away with this behavior or throwing tantrums. I would never dream of demanding any type of ring. If I don't like it, I simply won't wear it. I'll hang it on a chain "close to my heart".

[1MOREMOD]

I didn't know I got the choice to have wife pay for it.

[Reborn_]

Originally Posted by F87LUV

It shouldn't be an argument. It's your money. What the hell? Idk how some women get away with this behavior or throwing tantrums. I would never dream of demanding any type of ring. If I don't like it, I simply won't wear it. I'll hang it on a chain "close to my heart".

Blows me away how many dummies propose to girls who have "minimum" specs for the engagement ring. Good luck with her, fella.

[Taskmaster]

In my experience they prefer girth

Kidding dude, grats on the engagement!

[David70]

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

I didn't know I got the choice to have wife pay for it.

If you spend a large amount of money for a purchase, more than you can afford (payments or draining savings), then get married, you don't think she will also be paying for it one way or the other?

I am always surprised at the "he bought it for me by taking out a huge loan and it's just great" or the "I am going to buy an M3 before we get married as once we do it will never fly or make any sense".

[bruza]

Originally Posted by Reborn_

Blows me away how many dummies propose to girls who have "minimum" specs for the engagement ring. Good luck with her, fella.

That's why there has been no proposal yet.

[bruza]

Originally Posted by Naz24

Go get a 10k ring at costco (which would cost 15-20k at tiffany) throw it in the tiff box and she will never know

Great idea here

[Reborn_]

Originally Posted by bruza

That's why there has been no proposal yet.

Good for you, man. That kind of behavior or expectation is ridic.

Originally Posted by David70

If you spend a large amount of money for a purchase, more than you can afford (payments or draining savings), then get married, you don't think she will also be paying for it one way or the other?

I am always surprised at the "he bought it for me by taking out a huge loan and it's just great" or the "I am going to buy an M3 before we get married as once we do it will never fly or make any sense".

I'm with you on this.

[bruza]

Originally Posted by F87LUV

It shouldn't be an argument. It's your money. What the hell? Idk how some women get away with this behavior or throwing tantrums. I would never dream of demanding any type of ring. If I don't like it, I simply won't wear it. I'll hang it on a chain "close to my heart".

I agree entirely. It's her immature behavior that breeds this kind of thought. I'm in no rush to get married (more her than me) so I'll continue to hold out.

Thanks everyone else for their input. I'm not stressing the topic too much, but just happened to see this thread so thought I'd chime in.

[F87LUV]

Originally Posted by bruza

I agree entirely. It's her immature behavior that breeds this kind of thought. I'm in no rush to get married (more her than me) so I'll continue to hold out.

Thanks everyone else for their input. I'm not stressing the topic too much, but just happened to see this thread so thought I'd chime in.

Yeah, I'm holding out for someone that's fine with simply giving me an almost perfect diamond band and splitting a 911 with me instead.

[Naz24]

Originally Posted by F87LUV

Yeah, I'm holding out for someone that's fine with simply giving me an almost perfect diamond band and splitting a 911 with me instead.

Now if only every girl thought like you....

[F87LUV]

Originally Posted by Naz24

Now if only every girl thought like you....

They'd be #foreveralone like me too.

The smart ones are the ones that nag until they get their way.

[BayMoWe335]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

Impressive to who? Who would ever know that the stone is flawless? Nobody is buying a piss yellow stone, but you can certainly get a larger stone that would pass ANY naked eye test for much less than a perfect grain of sand.

The other caveat I said was 1 carat at least.

Impressive to the people wearing it and buying it (you and your wife).

To me, nothing about a "bang for buck" makes much sense for a diamond. It's ALL about the rarity.

Like I said, a fake diamond passes the naked eye test. But you'll say, "OH BUT IT'S FAKE!!"

Well, you can't have it both ways. If you "know" it's fake, you also know the diamond is shitty regardless of any naked eye test. Similarly, you'll know the diamond is legit regardless of any naked eye test.

Like I said, you can spend $10,000 and get a 1 carat or $10,000 and probably get a 3 carat. Size doesn't matter...they cost the same for reason and the reason is the much larger one is an incredibly fucked up diamond.

[John Tanglewood]

Go get a synthetic diamond! Sure it wasn't milled from millions of years in the earth, but you can literally get a true, real, flawless diamond for a fraction of the price.

The diamond game is an incredible sham, you'd do yourself (and your wallet) a favor.