[IB M]

Drop that V8 in the Supra!

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

The future is planetary autos with wet clutches rather than a torque converter. Benz is already doing it.

Tell that to Porsche who keep perfecting their PDK in GT cars...and Ferrari, McLaren, Lamborghini...etc. The ZF in the G8x is a downgrade. Dumping the dct does save BMW a lot of money though. Benz never put a dct in their C63 or E63, their auto trans are still inferior even after the new generation. Benz knows what is for performance as they have a dct in their AMG GT sports car. DCT can handle a lot of power if they are built for it, look at Merc's AMG GT Black Series.

[DriverDaily]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

Smiles per gallon? Let me guess, you never drove a Lexus before. My previous car was a Lexus IS350. Soulless.

Soulless? Let me guess, you never drove an IS F or LC500 before?

[damnitBobby]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

Smiles per gallon? Let me guess, you never drove a Lexus before. My previous car was a Lexus IS350. Soulless.

My brother has a GSF with the 5.0 V8. Can confirm more smiles per gallon in that car.

Let me tell you our F80 sounds like a lawn mower in comparison.

[MisterF80M3]

Originally Posted by DriverDaily

Soulless? Let me guess, you never drove an IS F or LC500 before?

I actually test drove an IS-F, GS-F, and C63 before purchasing my F80. IS-F and GS-F were just a complete letdown. C63 drove significantly better than IS-F and GS-F, IMO. Lexus was just soulless. They are known to make soulless luxury cars.

Originally Posted by damnitBobby

My brother has a GSF with the 5.0 V8. Can confirm more smiles per gallon in that car.

Let me tell you our F80 sounds like a lawn mower in comparison.

I didn't know smiles per gallon are measured by how a car sound and not how well a car drives.

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

I didn't know smiles per gallon are measured by how a car sound and not how well a car drives.

Sound is part of the equation for many.

[supra93]

One of LE's moderators Mike seems to be hinting at something else in the pipe lines for the IS.

Originally Posted by mikeavelli

Obviously I’m sworn to secrecy but there’s some really dope things coming with this car. Keeping it relevant to this thread.

Get the checkbooks ready lol

[Sublime00]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

What do you look at in a performance car with 500HP V8? It's not like Lexus is built for the track either.

Most cars you are buying aren't "built for the track" including M cars.

[Sublime00]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

I actually test drove an IS-F, GS-F, and C63 before purchasing my F80. IS-F and GS-F were just a complete letdown. C63 drove significantly better than IS-F and GS-F, IMO. Lexus was just soulless. They are known to make soulless luxury cars.

I didn't know smiles per gallon are measured by how a car sound and not how well a car drives.

Disagree completely on the soulless part of this statement. I drove the same cars and found the GSF to be a blast and it drove and sounded significantly better than the Benz. Yes it was slower but I don't care about a faster 0-60 or 1/4 mile time. The German cars I drove felt soulless snd numb, and a little gimmicky. GSF felt significantly better and was a more focused and cohesive car. That's why I bought it.

But some cars resonate with some buyers, and others don't. Nice to have variety and I'm glad the IS500 will add a sport sedan option to buyers short list.

[MmmmmM2]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

Smiles per gallon? Let me guess, you never drove a Lexus before. My previous car was a Lexus IS350. Soulless.

Agreed....I really disliked my 17 IS350 F Sport.

[bkfastwagon]

Originally Posted by MmmmmM2

Agreed....I really disliked my 17 IS350 F Sport.

Not clear what that has to do with 2022 IS500? BMW 330i is also a terribly boring car, does that mean M340 and M3 are soulless?

[Humdizzle]

- M3 is alot lighter, like 350 pounds lighter. (IS500 is supposedly only 50 pounds lighter than the 4000 pound RCF)
- M3 has alot more power (especially with a $600 tune).
- M3 has the option of manual or DCT, lexus you only get an auto.
- The Lexus has a great sounding 5.0 V8.

I do love v8 noises but the more i read about this car... the weight, power, and transmission disadvantages might be too much for the v8 to overcome.

[bkfastwagon]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

- M3 is alot lighter, like 350 pounds lighter. (IS500 is supposedly only 50 pounds lighter than the 4000 pound RCF)
- M3 has alot more power (especially with a $600 tune).
- M3 has the option of manual or DCT, lexus you only get an auto.
- The Lexus has a great sounding 5.0 V8.

i do love v8 noises but the more i read about this car... the weight, power, and transmission disadvantages might be too much for the v8 to overcome.

I don't think IS 500 is meant to compete against M3. They will need IS F to do that (probably V8 TT). Looking at its spec, it's more of a 340i/audi S4 competitor. A nice daily driver with V8 rumble.

[R N M]

Originally Posted by bkfastwagon

I don't think IS 500 is meant to compete against M3. They will need IS F to do that (probably V8 TT). Looking at its spec, it's more of a 340i/audi S4 competitor. A nice daily driver with V8 rumble.

Correct!

Lexus realized they can’t go head to toe with M3 because they will lose every measurable contest.

So they made this Fsport + variant that should be performance and price competitive with M340i. It will also appeal to current ISF and E9x owners that only want NA V8s in small sedan.

I think it was great idea and should sell well.

My big gripe is them not using the new 10speed auto and not offering sportier seats compared to base IS.

[Humdizzle]

Originally Posted by R N M

Correct!

Lexus realized they can’t go head to toe with M3 because they will lose every measurable contest.

So they made this Fsport + variant that should be performance and price competitive with M340i. It will also appeal to current ISF and E9x owners that only want NA V8s in small sedan.

I think it was great idea and should sell well.

My big gripe is them not using the new 10speed auto and not offering sportier seats compared to base IS.

i agree it kind of feels like a cop out. "well our RCF can't compete with the M cars, so lets make it a 4 door and have it compete with the m-sport lineup"

The stock M340i is quite a bit faster than the RCF straight line, a bit faster on track too. Add in a tune (which you can't really do on an NA lexus) and the gap grows alot more in favor of the BMW.

so it come back around to the question: is the V8 sound, throttle response, and 'feel' of the car enough to make up for the performance deficit?

personally i hope it is. but they have their work cutout for them. if they can make the car feel like an E39 M5 in terms of the feel they might have a hit.

[Vivek.]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

i agree it kind of feels like a cop out. "well our RCF can't compete with the M cars, so lets make it a 4 door and have it compete with the m-sport lineup"

The stock M340i is quite a bit faster than the RCF straight line, a bit faster on track too. Add in a tune (which you can't really do on an NA lexus) and the gap grows alot more in favor of the BMW.

so it come back around to the question: is the V8 sound, throttle response, and 'feel' of the car enough to make up for the performance deficit?

personally i hope it is. but they have their work cutout for them. if they can make the car feel like an E39 M5 in terms of the feel they might have a hit.

The e39 m5 is an interesting comparison because for being 23ish years newer and +75hp, the IS500 doesn't seem particularly better (faster) on paper than the e39 M5.

[dscabra]

All the performance discussion aside, what about the simple case of wanting a reliable daily driver sedan with a V8 that won't drain the bank account when dealer service is required and DIY maintenance is dirt cheap and simple to do? At some point, this is an appealing product for a lot of people that also have a high-performance car in the stable.

[Humdizzle]

Originally Posted by Vivek.

The e39 m5 is an interesting comparison because for being 23ish years newer and +75hp, the IS500 doesn't seem particularly better (faster) on paper than the e39 M5.

yeah on paper they are similar. nearly 4000 pounds with a 5 liter v8. I looked up e39 stats and they trap about 109-112 in the 1/4 mile. About the same as a current RCF which motortrend had at 112mph. So i doubt the is 500 will be a significant improvement on that front.

hopefully they can at least make the steering have that same type of feedback and feel and make the transmission as snappy as a DCT.

[MmmmmM2]

Originally Posted by bkfastwagon

Not clear what that has to do with 2022 IS500? BMW 330i is also a terribly boring car, does that mean M340 and M3 are soulless?

Lexus just are not my cup of tea. They do absolutely NOTHING for me (except the LFA).

[Banana Clipper]

Looks like my wife’s old IS250. Fun car but wasn’t very fast. V8 should be nice and black on clack would be a killer look for any IS

[MisterF80M3]

Originally Posted by Sublime00

Most cars you are buying aren't "built for the track" including M cars.

Pass me some of that good sh*t you are smoking.

BMW M3 CS Is The Second Fastest Sedan To Lap The Nurburgring

https://carbuzz.com/news/bmw-m3-cs-i...he-nurburgring

[Sublime00]

Originally Posted by MisterF80M3

Pass me some of that good sh*t you are smoking.

BMW M3 CS Is The Second Fastest Sedan To Lap The Nurburgring

https://carbuzz.com/news/bmw-m3-cs-i...he-nurburgring

My statement didn't include CS and CSL variants. Sure you can take Comps on the track but even those are more for street use.

This is by design from BMW and they're own thinking behind the M nomenclature.

IS500 is not competing with an M3 competition, a CS or CSL variant of an M car.

Sure there's some overlap with an M3 and M3 comp, but the IS is designed for spirited street use. That's one of the reasons this is not branded as an ISF.

Come through, I'll share some of my good shit.