[swagon]

Originally Posted by jmg

Considering the 3.0 as a track car to replace my M3 CS. Anyone here have track experience with one? I don't care about the looks, I think it looks decent, I care about how it drives. I want a manual but I heard the ZF is actually decent. Thoughts?

Why not a used M2C 6MT that you can modify? Unless you only want a brand new car.

I've read they might offer a manual in the next few years, but I wouldn't hold onto that information.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by chris719

Good attitude, pro tax evasion. Don't like the taxes? Don't live there. You have a choice and you can reside in Montana or some other lower tax state. If you don't like it, you should move instead of cheating on taxes.

"Tax evasion" is illegal. Since this is completely legal, it is not tax evasion. Is it completely ethical? That is another question, and arguably subjective.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by swagon

Why not a used M2C 6MT that you can modify? Unless you only want a brand new car.

I've read they might offer a manual in the next few years, but I wouldn't hold onto that information.

That's a strong possibility. I was looking forward to sitting in something that isn't an M car, I've had two F80's already and the cockpit of the M2 is similar enough. Yes, I understand the irony in the fact that the Supra interior is pretty much a BMW, but it's different enough.

[supra93]

[swagon]

Originally Posted by jmg

That's a strong possibility. I was looking forward to sitting in something that isn't an M car, I've had two F80's already and the cockpit of the M2 is similar enough. Yes, I understand the irony in the fact that the Supra interior is pretty much a BMW, but it's different enough.

That's true.

Just not sure how you'd feel about the ZF8 after your DCT F80s. It's well-tuned in the Supra from what I know, though, but you know, the ZF8 ends where the DCT just starts when it comes to sporty feeling and aggressive driving.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by swagon

That's true.

Just not sure how you'd feel about the ZF8 after your DCT F80s. It's well-tuned in the Supra from what I know, though, but you know, the ZF8 ends where the DCT just starts when it comes to sporty feeling and aggressive driving.

Thats one of my biggest concerns. I'm hoping the lighter, shorter car would make up for any shortcomings of the gearbox. Of course, I could always just get a 981 GTS manual, which is still a contender.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by jmg

You don't lie because you don't have to be a resident or even be in the state. You just have to file for an LLC and have a registered agent in the state of Montana. Again, Montana gains financially from that as described in my post. Yes, another state loses out on sales tax, but that's the "free market". Montana won their business with an incentive, and it's financially viable. Other states can do the same and benefit similarly, but they feel that taxing car sales generates more income for them. That's capitalism, it's not cheating.

It is not an issue of Montana law, it's with your actual home state. It's also an issue with your insurance company. It is absolutely cheating. CHP has a website to turn people in, and other states in the Northeast are also very aggressive. There are lots of threads on this all over the internet and have been for years. If you attempt this in 2020 and daily drive the car you are asking for trouble. Maybe you will get away with it, but people with several exotic cars have had their homes raided in Georgia.

I have no idea why you think your home state is fine with you not paying sales tax on a new car purchase (if it has such a tax). If you live in Montana or actually operate out of Montana, so be it, but that is not what this scam is about. In most states, if you garage it in the state and drive it in the state, you will owe sales and/or use tax.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by chris719

It's not about Montana, it's about lying about your actual place of residence or business to cheat your home state out of sales tax.

Damn you’re one eager beaver to pay to Uncle Sam what isn’t his.

First born named Bernie by any chance?

[chris719]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

Damn you’re one eager beaver to pay to Uncle Sam what isn’t his.

First born named Bernie by any chance?

I'm not a morally bankrupt POS so I pay what I legally owe. Law and Order, amirite? If I didn't want to pay tax that badly I'd move to some other state.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by chris719

I'm not a morally bankrupt POS so I pay what I legally owe. Law and Order, amirite?

Legally I don’t owe the taxes I am forced to pay. It’s not even subjective, it’s been covered ad nauseam throughout the annals of the internet.

I’m not defending the Montana loophole for the record, I see this in AZ all the time and I roll my eyes as well. I simply take offense to anyone justifying the tax structure were thrust into. Disgusting.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

Legally I don’t owe the taxes I am forced to pay. It’s not even subjective, it’s been covered ad nauseam throughout the annals of the internet.

I’m not defending the Montana loophole for the record, I see this in AZ all the time and I roll my eyes as well. I simply take offense to anyone justifying the tax structure were thrust into. Disgusting.

LOL, you can take your extreme libertarian BS and shove it. Move to somewhere with lower taxes if you can't stomach it. There is always somewhere cheaper. You can vote, too, can't you?

I don't enjoy paying taxes but I do it because I understand it's required to have a functioning government and local services. Why are there so many extremists on this forum?

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by chris719

LOL, you can take your extreme libertarian BS and shove it. Move to somewhere with lower taxes if you can't stomach it. There is always somewhere cheaper. You can vote, too, can't you?

I don't enjoy paying taxes but I do it because I understand it's required to have a functioning government and local services. Why are there so many extremists in this sub?

I’m extreme because I too don’t enjoy paying taxes? So quick to name call and separate yet we seem to agree on more than disagree...

Quite the neat one you are. Dare I say, extreme...?

[chris719]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

I’m extreme because I too don’t enjoy paying taxes? So quick to name call and separate yet we seem to agree on more than disagree...

Quite the neat one you are. Dare I say, extreme...?

You don't legally owe the taxes you are forced to pay? lol

Nah, I've seen your other posts, too.

[fiveohwblow]

Originally Posted by chris719

You don't legally owe the taxes you are forced to pay? lol

Nah, I've seen your other posts, too.

So extreme voyeur? Go on...

[chris719]

Originally Posted by fiveohwblow

So extreme voyeur? Go on...

That sentence alone was enough to let me know where you stand. I don't need to continue dragging this thread off-topic and you aren't worth the time.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by jmg

My only concern is the weight. The M2 will definitely get heavier. If it stays under 3700 I think it will be a winner. Otherwise the Supra is already lighter than the current M2.

I agree. The problem is also it's a 2 series still. It's going to sit higher and not have the same seating position or feel. That's one of the biggest things I hate about the current M2. I almost don't trust BMW to dial it in either, considering how much better the Supra is than the Z4. I'd already have a Supra if it came with a manual.

[SickGTR]

Originally Posted by chris719

Good attitude, pro tax evasion. Don't like the taxes? Don't live there. You have a choice and you can reside in Montana or some other lower tax state. If you don't like it, you should move instead of cheating on taxes.

That's what you worried about? Give me a fucking break. Some normal everyday hard working homie trying to save a bit on taxes? The states fuck you every which way they can. Buy a new car, pay taxes on it. Sell that and the next guy pays taxes on it. Sell it the 3rd time it's taxed again. All the people in politics with insider trading and all that shit, try worry about real crooks. Cheat, steal, avoid all those taxes as best you can!! No state is ever out to help their own residents. If you feel they are, I have a winning lottery ticket I can sell you. Call me

[chris719]

Originally Posted by SickGTR

That's what you worried about? Give me a fucking break. Some normal everyday hard working homie trying to save a bit on taxes? The states fuck you every which way they can. Buy a new car, pay taxes on it. Sell that and the next guy pays taxes on it. Sell it the 3rd time it's taxed again. All the people in politics with insider trading and all that shit, try worry about real crooks. Cheat, steal, avoid all those taxes as best you can!! No state is ever out to help their own residents. If you feel they are, I have a winning lottery ticket I can sell you. Call me

I didn't say I wasn't worrying about real crooks. We can, you know, do more than one thing at a time. I prefer to be honest, that's all. I don't endorse the "fuck you, got mine" mentality that some of you seem to.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by chris719

It is not an issue of Montana law, it's with your actual home state. It's also an issue with your insurance company. It is absolutely cheating. CHP has a website to turn people in, and other states in the Northeast are also very aggressive. There are lots of threads on this all over the internet and have been for years. If you attempt this in 2020 and daily drive the car you are asking for trouble. Maybe you will get away with it, but people with several exotic cars have had their homes raided in Georgia.

I have no idea why you think your home state is fine with you not paying sales tax on a new car purchase (if it has such a tax). If you live in Montana or actually operate out of Montana, so be it, but that is not what this scam is about. In most states, if you garage it in the state and drive it in the state, you will owe sales and/or use tax.

I wasn't fully aware of the crackdown. I guess it is illegal, and in that case you are right. If you have to lie to your insurance co about where the car is etc then that is a problem. I assumed people were using loopholes to get around insurance problems like storing their exotics in Montana for a certain amount of time out of the year etc. I do feel, however, that it is the taxpayer's responsibility to utilize every tax advantage strategy they can. It's not that I don't believe in paying taxes, I do and I pay a lot, but if I didn't take advantage of every tax incentives out there, then not only would I be paying much more, but I wouldn't be fulfilling the role of those tax incentives: stimulate a sector of the economy through targeted incentives. It's not JUST to save people money, it's to encourage a wanted behavior. Want to sell more trucks? Give a tax write off for trucks. Want to encourage charitable contributions? Write off. I don't think wanting to pay less taxes is morally bankrupt so long as you are being honest and within the boundaries of the law.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by jmg

I wasn't fully aware of the crackdown. I guess it is illegal, and in that case you are right. If you have to lie to your insurance co about where the car is etc then that is a problem. I assumed people were using loopholes to get around insurance problems like storing their exotics in Montana for a certain amount of time out of the year etc. I do feel, however, that it is the taxpayer's responsibility to utilize every tax advantage strategy they can. It's not that I don't believe in paying taxes, I do and I pay a lot, but if I didn't take advantage of every tax incentives out there, then not only would I be paying much more, but I wouldn't be fulfilling the role of those tax incentives: stimulate a sector of the economy through targeted incentives. It's not JUST to save people money, it's to encourage a wanted behavior. Want to sell more trucks? Give a tax write off for trucks. Want to encourage charitable contributions? Write off. I don't think wanting to pay less taxes is morally bankrupt so long as you are being honest and within the boundaries of the law.

Yeah, I'm not complaining about legal avenues. This is technically illegal in most states.

[supra93]

[supra93]