[baege]

So we all know about the trend towards turbos and away from normal aspiration.

I tried to resist but in the end could not simply find a normally aspirated car that otherwise met my parameters...and so I ended up in a 2018 m240i with the b58, which is one of the least laggy motors out there...but alas there is still lag.

I have come to recognize the stages of the loss of normal aspiration grief as follows:

1. shock...my test drives of the b58 didn't unmask the extent to which turbo lag still presented itself in everyday driving...in my first couple days of everyday driving, I was shocked at how present lag still was

2. Anger...I felt cheated, I thought the b58 was the unicorn, the one turbo motor that didn't feel like a turbo motor, but alas it wasn/t

3. Denial...for a while I told myself it didn't matter, turbo lag so what, no big deal, I am getting used to it, car is still blindingly fast so what if there is lag and less connection

4. Acceptance...I finally moved to a place where I realized turbo lag was real and it did matter in my driving experience. I didn't feel as connected to the drive as I did with my normally aspirated cars. But I moved on to accept that this just a reality of our modern driving experience, and to live with it

5. Hope...the final stage I've arrived at is to recognize that one day I will be back with normal aspiration and I when I am in a place again in life where I can have a wonderful torquey normally aspirated car with a manual transmission I will hold on to it, until and unless they start making them again.

Hope this post helps other NA mourners out there

You are not alone

[c1pher]

Originally Posted by baege

So we all know about the trend towards turbos and away from normal aspiration.

I tried to resist but in the end could not simply find a normally aspirated car that otherwise met my parameters...and so I ended up in a 2018 m240i with the b58, which is one of the least laggy motors out there...but alas there is still lag.

I have come to recognize the stages of the loss of normal aspiration grief as follows:

1. shock...my test drives of the b58 didn't unmask the extent to which turbo lag still presented itself in everyday driving...in my first couple days of everyday driving, I was shocked at how present lag still was

2. Anger...I felt cheated, I thought the b58 was the unicorn, the one turbo motor that didn't feel like a turbo motor, but alas it wasn/t

3. Denial...for a while I told myself it didn't matter, turbo lag so what, no big deal, I am getting used to it, car is still blindingly fast so what if there is lag and less connection

4. Acceptance...I finally moved to a place where I realized turbo lag was real and it did matter in my driving experience. I didn't feel as connected to the drive as I did with my normally aspirated cars. But I moved on to accept that this just a reality of our modern driving experience, and to live with it

5. Hope...the final stage I've arrived at is to recognize that one day I will be back with normal aspiration and I when I am in a place again in life where I can have a wonderful torquey normally aspirated car with a manual transmission I will hold on to it, until and unless they start making them again.

Hope this post helps other NA mourners out there

You are not alone

There is some lag in my 718, or at least a place where power suddenly surges. I do not really have that with the 135is. It’s too bad you couldn’t get straight with the Vette. I really enjoy driving that beast. What about an F Type R?

[baege]

Originally Posted by MGM135is

There is some lag in my 718, or at least a place where power suddenly surges. I do not really have that with the 135is. It’s too bad you couldn’t get straight with the Vette. I really enjoy driving that beast. What about an F Type R?

I love the f type R and that would have been what I would have gotten over the m240i if not for the compromise of domestic life (my partner felt she couldn't handle such a beast and said we needed at least a 4 seater)

the f type R is an absolute riot and has so much immediate low end torque...I do wish it came in a manual, but it's still a contender for the car I hold onto

[3GFX]

You just need a bigger turbo so that when the lag is finally over your seat is happy

[c1pher]

Originally Posted by baege

I love the f type R and that would have been what I would have gotten over the m240i if not for the compromise of domestic life (my partner felt she couldn't handle such a beast and said we needed at least a 4 seater)

911 Turbo has a back seat.

[baege]

Originally Posted by MGM135is

911 Turbo has a back seat.

ha ha, still a turbo and outside the budget

[Alfisti]

I know you say you know the difference but are you SURE it's not throttle lag? It staggers me how much throttle lag there is programmed into BMWs.

On a related note, I am beginning to shop for a toy car or angry DD and I have it down to three cars, 911 S, Mustang V8 or rod bearing M3.

Notice a trend?

[IanMan]

Just purchase a Lamborghini and call it a day.

[Darth One]

I’m curious, what were your “NA parameters”?

My powertrain parameters for a fun car have usually been NA, MT, RWD, sounds great, and high revving if possible. There are still a precious few of those cars out there, but (a) not for long and (b) not for cheap.

Your “hope” stage is probably never going to pan out so my plan is to hoard these cars till i die.

[saeyedoc]

Yeah, I'm holding onto my '13C2S for a while, just bought a 3 year warranty.

[BayE30]

BMW died in my eyes after the s65 stopped production.

[BMWILUVU]

I drive in Sport+ and the turbo lag is nowhere. Other makes have a real turbo lag problem.

[irishbimmer]

Gotta say in sport plus there is no turbo lag-and when moving into higher rpms the performance is sensational.

[Soterios]

I mean....I get that lag is a bummer, but I'd rather have a little bit of lag and 300hp than no lag and 200hp.

[Biginboca]

Originally Posted by Soterios

I mean....I get that lag is a bummer, but I'd rather have a little bit of lag and 300hp than no lag and 200hp.

But it’s not an either/or... you can get 300hp, 400hp, or even 500hp with no lag in a N/A motor too

OP I feel you. I’m also committed to N/A (and 6MT lol)

[irishbimmer]

I've had a tuned 2010 V10 which was sweet-about 530hp and my newer M6 has about 575(twin turbo) and it is demonstrably faster.

[Soterios]

Originally Posted by Biginboca

But it’s not an either/or... you can get 300hp, 400hp, or even 500hp with no lag in a N/A motor too

OP I feel you. I’m also committed to N/A (and 6MT lol)

You can make anything with anything with enough time and money.

Generally I was comparing the 128 and the 135. And BMW does a lot of trims that way.

The kind of money you have to put into an NA car to get similar power gains (at least for the little inline six's that BMW uses) is pretty outrageous.

[Biginboca]

Originally Posted by Soterios

The kind of money you have to put into an NA car to get similar power gains (at least for the little inline six's that BMW uses) is pretty outrageous.

That is right on point, and sadly I’m very familiar with this topic lol. The only thing I’ll add is that alot of the money for the n/a mods is recovered in the lower purchase price of the N/A car. So if it cost $2500 to add 70hp to the n/a car usually the n/a car is priced around $2k less also.

[Soterios]

Originally Posted by Biginboca

That is right on point, and sadly I’m very familiar with this topic lol. The only thing I’ll add is that alot of the money for the n/a mods is recovered in the lower purchase price of the N/A car. So if it cost $2500 to add 70hp to the n/a car usually the n/a car is priced around $2k less also.

Perhaps, but there's still a limit to those returns. I probably could have spend $6,000 less on a comparable 128i, but I really doubt I would have a 375hp car with the difference and a 128i. There's only so much you can do to a motor before it gets silly.

[RM7]

Given the difference between my bmw driving modes and driving old school turbo cars, it’s not turbo lag when you are driving modern turbo cars (hot-v, short headers, twin scrolls, etc.) that produce full torque at 1500-1700, its throttle response and the automatic transmission. If you are feeling significant turbo lag, IMO you don’t know what it’s like to drive a car that needs 2800-3000 rpm before it wakes up and one that WILL NOT climb to that rpm under load in too high of a gear.

[Efthreeoh]

Sorry for the edit... but there is a 6th stage :

5. Hope...the final stage I've arrived at is to recognize that one day I will be back with normal aspiration and I when I am in a place again in life where I can have a wonderful torquey normally aspirated car with a manual transmission I will hold on to it,

6. Pipe Dream...until and unless they start making them again.

[TheMidnightNarwhal]

Originally Posted by Biginboca

But it’s not an either/or... you can get 300hp, 400hp, or even 500hp with no lag in a N/A motor too

OP I feel you. I’m also committed to N/A (and 6MT lol)

Yeah but can you plug a tune and get lots of HP on N/A? No.