[xxForgedxx]

I can't help but notice what smack is talked about domestic cars, it seems that it is either a "built like crap" comment or a "my interior is better" comment. When in all seriousness the domestics have the majority of big hitter cars in the 400+hp performance market. Here is a list I have made of domestic cars that some tend to overlook or just plain not care for. Discussion is welcome.

Models over the past 5 years with 400+hp: 31
Models over the past 5 years with 500+hp: 17



Cadillac:

2005 CTS-V: 400hp/395tq

2009 CTS-V: 550hp/550tq

2006 XLR-V: 443hp/414tq

2009 STS-V: 469hp/439tq


Chevrolet:

2002-2004 Lingenfelter Corvette 427: 802hp/866tq

2002-2004 Corvette zO6: 405hp/400tq

2005 Corvette z51: 400hp/400tq

2008 Corvette: 436hp/428tq

2008 Corvette zO6: 505hp/470tq

2008 Lingenfelter Corvette 427: 725hp/730tq

2009 Corvette ZR1: 620hp/595tq

2009 Camaro: 422hp/408tq


Pontiac:

2006 GTO: 400hp/395tq


Chrysler:

1996 Viper R/T 10: 400hp/465tq

1999 Viper ACR: 460hp/500tq

2000 Viper R/T 10 GTS: 450hp/490tq

2003 Viper Hennessey Venom: 1050hp/1100tq

2004 Viper SRT-10: 510hp/535tq

2009 Viper Coupe: 600hp/560tq

2006 Grand Cherokee SRT-8: 420hp/420tq

2006 Hennessey SRT600 Grand Cherokee: 600hp/650tq

2006 SRT-8 300c: 425hp/420tq

2006 SRT-8 Charger: 425hp/420tq

2006 SRT-8 Magnum: 425hp/420tq

2009 SRT-8 Challenger: 425hp/420tq

2009 Hennessey SRT600 Challenger: 620hp/650tq

2005 SRT-10 Ram: 500hp/525tq

2005 Hennessey Venom 800 Ram: 800hp/850tq


Ford:

2003 SVT Cobra: 390hp/390tq

2007 Shelby GT500: 500hp/480tq

2008 Shelby GT500KR: 540hp/510tq

2008 Shelby GT500 Super Snake: 725hp

2006 Ford GT: 550hp/500tq

2006 Henfer T GT: 800hp

I think that is a pretty mean resume. All these cars are known the be very strong, reliable and fast.

[MMMazing07]

this forum has many BMW fanboys that swear by BMW. Its really funny they have no idea what they are talking about.

The thread about the Viper ACR going around the ring faster than the ZR1 and GTR got so much hate. All the haters believe in nice interiors and BMW power LOL. They need to have a reality check and get there heads out of their asses. So many people think vipers and vettes only go straight line when they are the only cars that pass me at the track

Originally Posted by cstavaru

Doesn't the Corvette have leaf springs ? Even in my emerging country the only vehicles with leaf springs are horse carriages

And did you try to gently press on the back panel of a Corvette ? Its just a thin film of plastic.

Also, pushrod engine...come on, what century are we living in ?

this guy gets his info from top gear

Originally Posted by J. Diddy

If you want to drag race and own a stripper's dream car, go for the Vette.

Originally Posted by simp0man

German car over a domestic any day.

its really annoying how ignorant people are. The interior argument is just an excuse

[san~man]

Leaf springs....haha. I got a good chuckle out of that comment.

[xxForgedxx]

Originally Posted by san~man

Leaf springs....haha. I got a good chuckle out of that comment.

And it is still a faster car than the M3 at the 1/4 track, road course, auto x you name it? with those leaf springs? Yeah, cute comment you just confirmed what the guy above you brought up

[NaTuReB0Y]

I'd still take my 330i over any of those cars listed above......

[xxForgedxx]

Originally Posted by NaTuReB0Y

I'd still take my 330i over any of those cars listed above......

lol

[TiAg335i]

Hey OP, you must be pretty damned ignorant to think that, somehow, because those cars are more powerful, they are better engineered. Your argument is weak.

[san~man]

Originally Posted by xxForgedxx

And it is still a faster car than the M3 at the 1/4 track, road course, auto x you name it? with those leaf springs? Yeah, cute comment you just confirmed what the guy above you brought up

Before you jump to conclusions, I wasn't knocking the vette. I drive a domestic too so I'm no hater. I simply didn't know they used a leaf spring

And if it matters my domestic will outhandle any 3 shy of an M or dedicated race car

[AJerman]

What so many people can't understand is that it's not a matter of who is better or worse, they aim for different goals. Domestic enthusiast cars tend to aim more for power than suspension, in Europe, enthusiast cars tend to aim for suspension more than power. There are a lot more good twisty roads in Europe to drive though to make the handling more important to a lot of people. It just depends on what market you aim for.

I had a 2003 Cobra before my BMW (I personally love both, raw V8 power, and also BMW's precision and handling). It came with with an IRS, one of the few Mustangs to ever have IRS, and you know what, I had a solid swap in it. Why? Because it wasn't a car that I drove around a track or around lower speed winding roads. It was a car that was made to go fast and straight. The stock IRS had trouble handling the power after a few mods and would wheel hop and tear itself up, so the live axle was the better idea.

It doesn't make a car superior because it can go around corners better. You could just as easily say that an American muscle type car is superior because it's faster. It all depends on what the car buyer is looking for, and having both means everyone is happy. Why does it have to be a matter of "your car is shit and mine is awesome"? Why can't it just be that you want something different out of your car? To think that domestic car makers CAN'T make a car that handles just as good, or that Euro car makers CAN'T make a car that's as fast, is silly, they just have different markets based on what sells.

[xxForgedxx]

Originally Posted by TiAg335i

Hey OP, you must be pretty damned ignorant to think that, somehow, because those cars are more powerful, they are better engineered. Your argument is weak.

Where did I say any of them were better engineered? Where did I state this was better than that ANYwhere in my post.

Hey TiAg335i, youre pretty ignorant considering I stated/claimed nothing of the sort. Maybe you should improve your reading comprehension or did your BMW not come with that package?

[UltimateBMW]

Looks to me like your just looking for a fight. What do you really expect us to say to a thread like this?

Take the stick out your ass and move on. Everyone on this board that owns a BMW loves how they drive and considering this is our own board we can trash talk, bash, and fanboi all we like here. Its all perfectly within reason, if not expected even. We aren't going to any great lengths to upsell our cars when its just posting onto our normal forums.

Besides, horsepower is cheap. Just listing a bunch of power numbers for random cars and then spouting out the Corvette/Viper argument is pretty hollow and worthless. You want kudos because they finally got it right on a few cars? Are your standards truly that low that your happy with 1 or 2 cars meeting par? Why not the entire model line-up.

[UltimateBMW]

Now the response you should of gotten.


lolumad?

[Zeiss]

Originally Posted by xxForgedxx

All these cars are known the be very strong, reliable and fast.

[Chris.G]

Ill stick with a Holden Special Vehicle thanks! Oh i wouldn't say no to a vette as well.

[ukthunderace]

Originally Posted by xxForgedxx

Where did I say any of them were better engineered? Where did I state this was better than that ANYwhere in my post.

Hey TiAg335i, youre pretty ignorant considering I stated/claimed nothing of the sort. Maybe you should improve your reading comprehension or did your BMW not come with that package?

Tool. Kid.
The whole retort (look it up Forged) above smacks of playground antics. It may as well say, "Hey TiAg335i, you're a big stupid doo doo head!"

[BMWJZ4]

Honestly, people look for different things when they purchase a car...let them who cares

[quagmire]

Originally Posted by BMWJZ4

Honestly, people look for different things when they purchase a car...let them who cares

That maybe true, but people are bashing domestics just because it is an American car. They will go, " Nice car, but too bad it is American". They are bashing it just because of the brands origin. Not because the car has faults that they hate.

[xxForgedxx]

Originally Posted by ukthunderace

Tool. Kid.
The whole retort (look it up Forged) above smacks of playground antics. It may as well say, "Hey TiAg335i, you're a big stupid doo doo head!"

Whatever you say, I'm not going to be called ignorant for XYZ when XYZ didn't even exsist.

[BMWJZ4]

Originally Posted by quagmire

That maybe true, but people are bashing domestics just because it is an American car. They will go, " Nice car, but too bad it is American". They are bashing it just because of the brands origin. Not because the car has faults that they hate.

Well, I'm guilty of that sometimes. Unfortunately, American cars have that rep.

[ianbiz]

Originally Posted by quagmire

That maybe true, but people are bashing domestics just because it is an American car. They will go, " Nice car, but too bad it is American". They are bashing it just because of the brands origin. Not because the car has faults that they hate.

guilty, but i can have some respect for them now. For instance the new CTS is a really good car, I could recommend it, but I wouldnt buy one.

[xxForgedxx]

Originally Posted by ianbiz

guilty, but i can have some respect for them now. For instance the new CTS is a really good car, I could recommend it, but I wouldnt buy one.

The thing that sucks about Cadillac, even new ones. They feel GREAT when new, the interiors, exteriors are great. But they age like a 55 year old bleach blonde smoker that tans religiously.

[ukthunderace]

Originally Posted by xxForgedxx

The thing that sucks about Cadillac, even new ones. They feel GREAT when new, the interiors, exteriors are great. But they age like a 55 year old bleach blonde smoker that tans religiously.

Honestly though Forged...you have drawn your conclusion about Cadillac due to its reputation as not being a car that keeps the characteristics you would buy it for in the first place.
That is all people are doing when talking about most American cars. While there are some really nice ones, such as those listed above, the majority have the reputation as being cheap and engineered to go in a straight line.